Re: [asa] Of motes and beams

Michael,

Thanks for this comment. However, I believe there is much more to be learned
from the Book of Job. You might care to read my response to George.

Vernon

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Roberts" <michael.andrea.r@ukonline.co.uk>
To: "George Murphy" <gmurphy@raex.com>; "Vernon Jenkins"
<vernon.jenkins@virgin.net>; "Don Nield" <d.nield@auckland.ac.nz>
Cc: <asa@calvin.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 11:02 PM
Subject: Re: [asa] Of motes and beams

> Job makes best sense when it is seen not as history but a superb story or
> even a novel or an epic poem considering suffering. It is one of my
> favourite OT books
>
> Michael
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "George Murphy" <gmurphy@raex.com>
> To: "Vernon Jenkins" <vernon.jenkins@virgin.net>; "Don Nield"
> <d.nield@auckland.ac.nz>
> Cc: <asa@calvin.edu>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 10:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [asa] Of motes and beams
>
>
>> Vernon -
>>
>> 1) Jesus told many stories. They are all true in the important sense
>> that they convey truth about the kingdom of God &c. Whether or not they
>> are true in the sense of being accurate historical reports is utterly
>> irrelevant. No serious Christian can dismiss stories as necessarily
>> untrue.
>>
>> 2) Whether or not human activity is "immune" from supernatural
>> interference is not the question. The fact that investigation based upon
>> MN has a great deal of success in understanding important aspects of
>> human activity shows that it is a very good working hypothesis & that
>> supernatural interference (to be distinguished, of course, from God's
>> concurrence with natural processes) is the exception - & in fact a quite
>> rare exception.
>>
>> I.e., both your claims are demostrably false. It would be nice to see
>> you admit it when you're wrong. People might take you more seriously if
>> you did.
>>
>> Shalom
>> George
>> http://web.raex.com/~gmurphy/
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Vernon Jenkins" <vernon.jenkins@virgin.net>
>> To: "Don Nield" <d.nield@auckland.ac.nz>
>> Cc: <asa@calvin.edu>
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 4:03 PM
>> Subject: Re: [asa] Of motes and beams
>>
>>
>>> Hi Don,
>>>
>>> Thanks for your comments. However, when you state that "The passages are
>>> theological stories about Satan.", does that mean you believe them to be
>>> untrue? If so, are you not surprised that God has allowed them to appear
>>> in His Revealed Word?
>>>
>>> On the other hand, if by these means it is intended that Christians be
>>> taught some of the fundamentals of life in the courts of heaven, you
>>> must surely agree that no form of human activity can be considered
>>> immune to supernatural interference. In such circumstances MN must cease
>>> to exist as a valid working hypothesis.
>>>
>>> Vernon
>>> www.otherbiblecode.com
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Don Nield" <d.nield@auckland.ac.nz>
>>> To: "Vernon Jenkins" <vernon.jenkins@virgin.net>
>>> Cc: <asa@calvin.edu>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 2:46 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [asa] Of motes and beams
>>>
>>>
>>>> Vernon:
>>>> The passages are theological stories about Satan. They have nothing to
>>>> do with science.
>>>> All discussion about God is concerned with the supernatural. But that
>>>> has nothing to do with methodological naturalism.
>>>> Don
>>>>
>>>> Vernon Jenkins wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Forum,
>>>>> I observe that many here are quick to pounce on any perceived
>>>>> weakness in the YEC position. But what of their own position as TEs?
>>>>> It appears to me that all are prepared to ignore some very fundamental
>>>>> Bible teaching. For example, concerning Job 1: 6-12, 2:1-6 and 1Kings
>>>>> 22:19-22, I am wondering what the purpose of these precious
>>>>> revelations might be if not to refute methodological naturalism -
>>>>> which all here appear to accept as a valid basis for practising
>>>>> science. Clearly, these extracts suggest that the _natural_ is, and
>>>>> always has been, open to supernatural activity - in God's wisdom, and
>>>>> at His discretion.
>>>>> It is interesting that Darwin's _goad_, Alfred Russell Wallace
>>>>> (undoubtedly, a reliable observer - though not a Christian) was
>>>>> convinced of the reality of the supernatural and wrote extensively of
>>>>> his first hand experiences of it. Many (including myself) would
>>>>> condemn his partiality for the seance - but his desire to learn,
>>>>> surely, cannot be faulted. On the other hand, our interest in the
>>>>> supernatural, as Christians, appears to begin and end with the
>>>>> resurrection. Is this really adequate for those who earnestly seek
>>>>> truth?
>>>>> Vernon
>>>>> www.otherbiblecode.com <http://www.otherbiblecode.com>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
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Received on Wed Jul 12 17:36:19 2006