RE: [asa] Random and natural vs intelligence

Lee Strobel is right. You can't have it both ways. Either God was involved
in which it wasn't random or if it was random then God couldn't have been
involved.

This is a valid critique of Collins as well. Fuz Rana interviewed Collins on
their radio broadcast and asked him that exact question, how he saw God's
involvement in creation if he accepted the totally random processes of
evolution? Collins waffled and said he didn't know.

This is a disingenuous and dishonest critique of ID by TE's. We all have to
accept some level of intelligent design in creation if we affirm God's role
in creation.

John

-----Original Message-----
From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On
Behalf Of Randy Isaac
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 9:26 PM
To: asa@calvin.edu
Subject: [asa] Random and natural vs intelligence

The November 2007 issue of Christianity Today includes a book review titled
"Deconstructing Dawkins" in which author Logan Paul Gage critiques McGrath's
book "The Dawkins Delusion." I don't think it's available online yet so let
me just type in two paragraphs of the article which I think deserve
discussion. My point is not to agree or disagree but to say that this is an
articulation of a critical point of difference within our communities that
needs to be clearly addressed.

"While theists can have a variety of legitimate views on life's evolution,
surely they must maintain that the process involves intelligence. So the
question is: Can an intelligent being use random mutations and natural
selection to create? No. This is not a theological problem; it is a logical
one. The words random and natural are meant to exclude intelligence. If God
guides which mutations happen, the mutations are not random; if God chooses
which organisms survive so as to guide life's evolution, the selection is
intelligent rather than natural.

"Theistic Darwinists maintain that God was "intimately involved" in
creation, to use Francis Collins's words. But they also think life developed
via genuinely random mutations and genuinely natural selection. Yet they
never explain what God is doing in this process. Perhaps there is still room
for him to start the whole thing off, but this abandons theism for deism."

This is essentially the same argument that Lee Strobel used on the radio a
few weeks ago when he firmly but respectfully rebuked Francis Collins.
Evolution is inherently random and without guidance and is therefore
mutually exclusive with divine guidance, he said.

Randy

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Received on Mon Nov 5 21:36:11 2007