Re: [asa] Letter to thinking Christians (and other theists)

While Denyse may not answer to the group, she has updated her posting

<quote>Note: A reader has kindly advised that in the first paragraph
above, the quoted author (George Murphy) is quoting someone else. I
didn't notice an attribution. My focus, however, is the readiness with
which the fans of Christian Darwinism flirt with dispensing with a
supernatural component in the human being. I am afraid that I have
never heard of an orthodox theology of the cross (an interest of
Murphy's) that denies humans a supernatural component. That is,
however, a pillar of orthodox Darwinism. I think that what Murphy, his
quotee, and many on the ASA list from which this sample was taken
clearly demonstrate is the slow rot of non-materialist understanding
of life that any long and close embrace of Darwinism brings about.
Mind you, I expect them to want to discuss just about anything
else.</quote>

How can accepting the facts of science lead to a slow rot I wonder?
Are Denyse's fears the reason why she seems ill informed on the topic
of Darwinism and other evolutionary sciences?
It would help understand a lot although I find it discouraging that
people are so often driven from science to pseudoscience based on
issues of faith or lack thereof. We see it with ID and global warming
deniers, who seem to be reluctant to accept the facts of science. Is
it out of fear of slipping away from their faith?
Personally, I find my faith strengthened by the findings of science.

On 4/16/07, Michael Roberts <michael.andrea.r@ukonline.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
> My sympathies with you David.
>
> As I have said before on this list, it is this kind of behaviour why I
> cannot take ID or YEC seriously. (Would James McHaffy care to comment on
> Dembksi and O'Leary's behaviour?)
>
> How they can reconcile this kind of misrepresentation with Christian honesty
> I do not know. Further there is no need to rubbish others as did Nelson over
> my late friend Peacocke and also Keith Miller.
>
> All this results in ID not only having zilch intellectual worth but no moral
> worth either.
>
> I am tempted to ask if Dembski and acolytes are not agents for Dawkins
>
> Michael
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David Opderbeck
> To: Dawsonzhu@aol.com
> Cc: pvm.pandas@gmail.com ; asa@calvin.edu
> Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 4:09 AM
> Subject: Re: [asa] Letter to thinking Christians (and other theists)
>
>
> Well, finally the other shoe dropped -- Bill Dembski removed me from the UD
> discussion. I invite you all to take a look at what I wrote and determine
> for yourselves whether it was warranted. It's really too bad --I'd like to
> have added something to the discussion of secondary causes, which, in
> typical fashion, is getting botched by Bill's and Denyse's sycophantic
> commentators.
>
> Shame on you, Bill, for letting this travesty of a post be published and for
> removing me as a result of a comment based on what actually transpired here
> on the ASA list and on a theological point about Aquinas. You are losing
> whatever battle it is you're fighting, and this kind of thing is why.
>
>
> On 4/15/07, Dawsonzhu@aol.com <Dawsonzhu@aol.com> wrote:
> > Within Denyse O'Leary's screed,
> >
> >
> > What you need to ask is a much simpler
> > and entirely determinable question: Is this stuff compatible with your
> > spiritual tradition? If not, recognize the situation for what it is:
> > undermining from within
> >
> > Hmmm, "spiritual tradition".... as in what, which
> > whose, where?
> >
> > I don't think Calvin dwells much on what a soul is
> > does he? He usually seemed to have the good sense
> > to stay out of meddling in matters well outside his
> > understanding of law, scripture and theology. It seems
> > to me, we might do well to follow such examples.
> >
> > At any rate, the one lesson we should understand by now is that
> > we don't know what the soul is and therefore, we are currently at
> > a loss on how to mesh it together with our scientific investigation
> > of the mind. Better that we learn to accept that we don't know how
> > to put it together, than to shout vociferously empty claims of such
> > knowledge and take the high and foolhardy road to thorough
> > destruction.
> >
> > by Grace we proceed,
> > Wayne
> >
>
>

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Received on Mon Apr 16 11:29:39 2007