Re: Cobb County

George,

In response to my email of 18 Jan you wrote:

"If Satan has such complete control over the world and human minds to make the great preponderance of evidence point toward a false picture of origins then Satan is, for all intents and purposes, the creator of the world we inhabit and of which we are part. This idea has always been recognized as a heresy -Manicheanism - by the Christian church. And if you then argue that Satan is in fact subservient to God then you are right back to the problem that Dave points out - that God is (albeit through the agency of Satan) deceitful."

Before moving on to refute these ideas, permit me to point to some further weapons in Satan's armoury: overseeing pyrotechnic displays in the heavens (e.g. SN 1987A); manipulating the speed of light and rates of decay of radioisotopes; laying false trails in the geologic column and ice-sheets; and so on. Such are well within his capabilities - and, with God's approval, must occur.

Now, while at first sight your defence of the Establishment position appears invincible, it ignores the general context within which my claims are being made viz the acceptance of the Judeo-Christian Scriptures as a body of divinely-revealed truth. In support of this understanding, let me quote the Apostle Paul: "All scripture (meaning the whole Bible) is given by inspiration of God..." (2Tm.3:16). He clearly regards it, in its entirety, as utterly true, for he continues, "...and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be perfect...". We therefore infer that the Bible's express purpose is to provide our souls with fundamental and necessary information that, otherwise, would be eternally hidden from us; as, for example, man's true nature (Gen.8:21, Jer.17:9), his need of salvation, and the way of salvation. Observe that included with this information are a number of significant warnings; of particular relevance are those relating to people who reject God (Ro.1:20-25) and those who take issue with what He has written -seeking to bring it into line with their own preconceived notions (2Pet.3:16).

God's response to those who attempt to supplant His account of creation by devising and promoting a philosophy (which, in fact, has the wider effect of challenging the whole of his revelation) must be _to give up on them_; they having become impossible to reason with. [I suggest that, as parents, we meet the same kind of problem when confronted with a child who obstinately refuses to accept the truth we tell him - and are likely to respond in the same way!]. But He might well go further when Satan comes along with his requests (as, for example, Job 1:6-12), by granting wide-ranging permission _to fulfil the expectations_ of those who have rejected God, His word, and its warnings.

Is God, then, deceitful? No, for God has provided a true account of things as they really are; in particular, Satan's character and peculiar function have been revealed - complete with a working example (i.e. the matter of Job), as also have the appropriate warnings against unbelief. Surely, the responsibility for all that now occurs falls on the individual who has rendered himself wilfully ignorant of these matters and has thereby placed himself outside the grace of God.

Shalom
Vernon
www.otherbiblecode.com
     
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: George Murphy
  To: Vernon Jenkins ; D. F. Siemens, Jr.
  Cc: asa@calvin.edu
  Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2005 1:26 PM
  Subject: Re: Cobb County

  Vernon -
      If Satan has such complete control over the world and human minds to make the great preponderance of evidence point toward a false picture of origins then Satan is, for all intents and purposes, the creator of the world we inhabit and of which we are part. This idea has always been recognized as a heresy - Manicheanism - by the Christian church. And if you then argue that Satan is in fact subservient to God then you are right back to the problem that Dave points out - that God is (albeit through the agency of Satan) deceitful.

  Shalom
  George
  http://web.raex.com/~gmurphy/
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Vernon Jenkins
    To: D. F. Siemens, Jr.
    Cc: asa@calvin.edu
    Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 7:29 PM
    Subject: Re: Cobb County

    Dave,

    Your email of 17 Jan included the following: "If the Creator produced this universe about 6000 years ago so that any rational observer thinks it is billions of years old, he is deliberately deceitful. Bluntly, your deity is a liar." A serious charge, indeed. You later go on to say, "I do vigorously oppose scientism, materialism, dogmatic naturalism, all positions which deny the God who is Truth.", and I am thus encouraged to offer a brief scriptural defence of my position.

     It seems to me that the one biblical character Christians find it hardest to talk about - or even acknowledge - is Satan. Yet our Lord describes him as "...the prince of this world..." (Jn.14:30) and "...a liar, and the father of it." (Jn.8:44). The apostles also warn us of him - notably in Eph.6:11 where Paul, speaking to believers, writes, "Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil." Yes, Satan - our adversary (1Pet.5:8) - is a real and powerful being; nevertheless, he is subservient to God (Job 1:6-12, 2:1-6) - and it appears that he is there, _unintentionally_ performing an important role in the unfathomable purposes of God.

    Now, on the basis of these revelations, one has to ask why many Christians appear to believe that a consideration of the _physical_ evidences alone is sufficient to sustain the confident claims made in respect of the age of the earth and God's method of creating. The answer is again to be found in the Scriptures where we read "...for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth..." (Gen.8:21)

    To summarise: my God is no liar; His word is true in its entirety. In believing differently, you have failed to heed its clear warnings and, in my view, have become embroiled in a gross deception. An eminent evangelical theologian here in the UK has described Darwin's, The Origin of Species as "more responsible for undermining people's faith and belief in the Scriptures, and in God's way of salvation, than any other single book." What a coup for Satan that was! - mass delusion on a world-wide scale - yet, in the wisdom of God, permitted, so that His sovereign purposes might be fulfilled.
Received on Thu Jan 20 18:53:06 2005