From: Walter Hicks (wallyshoes@mindspring.com)
Date: Wed Oct 08 2003 - 01:11:14 EDT
allenroy wrote:
> George Murphy wrote:
>
>> I will make one last try, since you
>> don't seem to have paid close attention to
>> what has been said. The original claim was
>> that, BEFORE the sin described in Genesis 3,
>> Adam & Eve walked & talked intimately with God
>> in the garden. It is whether they walked &
>> talked with God in the garden BEFORE they
>> sinned. & Genesis does not say that they did.
>
> GE 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the
> tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye,
> and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took
> some and ate it. She also gave some to her
> husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then
> the eyes of both of them were opened, and they
> realized they were naked; so they sewed fig
> leaves together and made coverings for
> themselves.
> GE 3:8 Then the man and his wife heard the sound
> of the LORD God as he was walking in the garden
> in the cool of the day, and they hid from the
> LORD God among the trees of the garden. 9 But
> the LORD God called to the man, "Where are you?"
>
> GE 3:10 He answered, "I heard you in the garden,
> and I was afraid because I was naked; so I hid."
> NIV
>
> So, here we have Adam and Eve sinning. They
> then "heard the sound of the LORD God... walking
> in the garden" and hide from Him.
>
> We have to ask:
> 1. How would they be able to recognize the
> "sound of God walking in the garden," unless
> they had already heard that very sound before
> and knew who it was walking in the garden?
>
> Why else would they hide if they had not
> recognized the sound?
>
> The only way that they could know who was
> walking in the garden was if they had heard the
> sound before -- i.e. before they sinned.
>
> 2. "God called to the man, "Where are you?""
>
> Adam did not ask 'who are you?" He already knew
> who it was because he recognized the sound --
> Adam said, "I heard you in the garden, and I was
> afraid". Adam, probably, also recognized God's
> voice.
>
> Again, the only way they could know who was
> walking and talking was because they had heard
> the sound and voice before, i.e. before they
> sinned.
>
> God was not walking around with a big neon sign
> flashing "GOD....GOD....GOD" -- Bzzt -- Bzzt --
> Bzzt. God was not "Thundering and Flashing"
> because they had sinned. He did not come in
> raging and shouting vindictives because of their
> sin. He came walking and asking to be with
> them. They knew Him because of the sound of His
> walking and His talking.
>
> All this implies that God had come walking and
> talking with them in the garden AT LEAST ONCE,
> before they sinned. And if at least once, then
> why not often? God is love. He created us so
> He could love us and so that we could love Him.
> Love requires relationship, interaction and
> intimacy. It is entirely within God's character
> to spend time with His loved ones as often as He
> can. Thus it is not without foundation that God
> came in the cool of the evenings on a regular
> basis to be with Adam and Eve. In that way,
> they would come to know and recognize the sounds
> of the God who walked and talked with them.
Maybe I am the only theological dummy on this list
----- but does not Genesis say (KJV)?:
15 And the LORD God took the man, and put him
into the
garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.
16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying,
Of every
tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and
evil, thou
shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou
eatest thereof thou
shalt surely die.
18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that
the man should
be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed
every beast of
the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought
them unto
Adam to see what he would call them: and
whatsoever Adam
called every living creature, that was the name
thereof.
20 And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the
fowl of the
air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam
there was not
found an help meet for him.
Given these words, how can we possibly think that
God was NOT talking to Adam during this time (pre
the "fall")?
I cannot imagine how such an interpretation could
be made.
Walt
===================================
Walt Hicks <wallyshoes@mindspring.com>
In any consistent theory, there must
exist true but not provable statements.
(Godel's Theorem)
You can only find the truth with logic
If you have already found the truth
without it. (G.K. Chesterton)
===================================
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