More about teaching the controversy

From: Bertvan@aol.com
Date: Thu Aug 10 2000 - 20:49:20 EDT

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    Bertvan:
    I was skeptical of Darwinism before I encountered you, Susan, but you are
    one of the causes of my distaste for "evolutionists". Many are as intolerant
    as you. (I know, you claim it is admirable to be intolerant of liars, which
    appears to include anyone who disagrees with you.) I have stated repeatedly
    that I do not object to anyone believing in Darwinism, atheism, materialism,
    Marxism, Freud, YEC, racism, or whatever. I don't even try to change their
    beliefs. I respect Chris's right to be a materialist. I don't usually
    express objection to your anti-religion paranoia. I merely insist on the
    right of everyone to express disagreement without being attacked or called
    names. Whenever I see anyone attacked for their beliefs, I will feel
    compelled to defend them. You seem to feel someone is trying to stuff theism
    down your throat. I haven't had that experience. Most of the people
    supporting ID appear quite tolerant and untroubled by my agnosticism.

    Bertvan:
    >>People with scientific degrees express differences
    >>of opinion, and I tend to trust those scientists who are civil, are tolerant
    >>of differences of opinion, and don't misrepresent those who disagree with
    >>them.

    Susan:
    >unless they come to a conclusion that you don't like
    snip
    >the attachment to RM&NS is based upon observations and the attachment to ID
    >is based on religion.

    Bertvan:
    I'm sure many people feel the same way, Susan. Our own beliefs are supported
    by evidence, but dissenting views are the result of superstition. I don't
    feel that way, myself. I defend *everyone's* right to dissent.

    Susan:
    >>you *must* dismiss the evidence and necessity for evidence and even avoid
    >>the discussion of the evidence because that evidence contradicts what you
    >>wish to believe.

    >propaganda is intended to sound reasonable--especially to people who
    >carefully shelter themselves from the evidence--or who have had the
    >evidence concealed from them.

    >yes. I'm afraid that one contingent of one of the many religions in the
    >U.S. will find a way to force their religion down the throats of all the
    >others. That Muslim and Hindu parents will be forced to pay for their
    >children to have a Christian education in *science* class. Yes, I'm afraid
    >of that. I hate it and I will fight against it. Yes, I will.

    Bertvan:
    You fear someone *might* find a way to stuff their religion down your throat.
     (It hasn't happened yet.) Well, Darwinists have *already* found ways to try
    to stuff "random mutation and natural selectin" down the throats of
    everyone, with the backing of the ACLU. They merely label any criticism of
    RM&NS as religion. The title of this thread is "teach the controversy".
    That's what I favor, Susan, teaching both sides of the controversy.

    Bertvan
    http://members.aol.com/bertvan



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