Re: Debate

Derek McLarnen (dmclarne@pcug.org.au)
Sat, 13 Dec 1997 22:01:48 +1100

I have been involved in debates here a year or more ago, but for those
who don't remember me, I'll post a short bio.

My name is Derek McLarnen. I live in Canberra, Australia. I am 41 years
old, married with 5 children and work as a telecommunications
consultant. While a nominal Anglican (Episcopalian is the US equivalent,
I think) and mostly living by Christian ethics, I classify myself as an
agnostic philosophically (since I don't know whether any deities exist),
and as an atheist for practical purposes (since I live as though no
deities exist). Technically, I suppose I could classify myself as a
modernist, but I don't see a compelling reason to do so. I have a strong
interest in exploring the areas where religion and science intersect,
but I am an amateur in these disciplines, not a professional (unless
someone can find me a place where religion intersects with
telecommunications theory or practice).

Jon Thompson quoted:

> __________________________________________________________________________
>
> Education is the most powerful ally of Humanism, and every American
> public
> school is a school of Humanism. What can the theistic Sunday Schools,
> meeting for an hour once a week,and teaching only a fraction of the
> children do to stem the tide of a five-day program of Humanistic
> teaching?
> Charles Francis
> Potter
>
> _________________________________________________________________________

My short answer is "Nothing!". And I would also suggest that American
public schools, if Australian public schools are any guide, have moved
away from "humanism" to become strong proponents of "ecoism" (a system
of values based on sound ecologically sustainable principles). And if
Christians thought the fight against secular humanism was a difficult
one, the fight against ecoism (both secular and new-age variants) will
make it look easy.

However, this quote of Potter's does raise a number of questions worthy
of debate.

Is education really the most powerful ally of humanism, or indeed an
ally of any type of -ism, or is Potter's claim merely rhetoric?

Are American public schools really schools of humanism or even ecoism?
individualism at best, or nihilism at worst.

Given that for much of the last 1600 years, education in the western
world was dominated by theistic, specifically Christian, institutions,
what has caused educational institutions to distance themselves from
Christian control and influence as soon as it became politically and
economically feasible to do so?

If one or more of the many theisms continue to have intrinsic value, why
has "Education" chosen after so many successful centuries of symbiosis,
to reject any role for theism in its programs?

If an education system is to endorse a system of theism, it can only
credibly endorse ONE, since few theisms cope well with pluralism. How is
an education system to determine which theism to endorse? In the past it
would appear that the decision was based on state law, state preference
or on the dominant theism of the parents of the students. Are these
valid methods of selecting a theism? If not, how should an educational
system select its preferred theism?

This quote appears to assume that it would be a good thing if "the tide
of a five-day program of Humanistic teaching" could be stemmed. I notice
this assumption among many Christians, but mostly evangelicals. They
appear to very rarely, if ever, question the worth of their belief
system, or their perception of the lack of worth in other belief
systems. They appear not to notice that the rest of the world,
particularly the western world, is putting a great deal of intellectual
effort into questioning all belief systems.

Is Potter's assumption, that it would be a good thing if "the tide of a
five-day program of Humanistic teaching" could be stemmed, a universally
valid assumption? Or is it only valid for supernaturalists? It is
difficult to argue with the evidence that humans exist. On the other
hand, gods or other supernatural entities have not been shown to be more
than hypotheses.

It should be remembered that, in the western world, we have tried the
five-day program of Christian teaching over many centuries. Surely it
wasn't rejected without serious consideration!

While schools have children for about 30 hours per week, and Sunday
schools have children for about 1 hour per week, the home/community has
children for about 67 waking hours per week (assuming 10 hours sleep per
night). On that basis I would suggest that the real problem for
proponents of the various theisms is not that they have lost the
respect/devotion of the educational system, but that they have lost the
respect/devotion of the wider community.

The fact is that, with the exception of a number of geographical
regions, the western world has largely, in fact if not yet in name,
moved beyond devoted support for the theisms. I don't expect that it
will return willingly.

Regards

Derek

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| Derek McLarnen | dmclarne@pcug.org.au |
| Melba ACT | derek.mclarnen@telstra.com.au |
| Australia | |
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