Re: [asa] fall of Satan logic questions (was: ID/Miracles/Design (Behe vs. Behe))

 Angels can be "bound", so I have in my head an image more like wrestling than sword-fighting.

-----Original Message-----
From: Dehler, Bernie <bernie.dehler@intel.com>
Cc: ASA <asa@calvin.edu>
Sent: Wed, 29 Apr 2009 3:47 pm
Subject: RE: [asa] fall of Satan logic questions (was: ID/Miracles/Design (Behe vs. Behe))

I was telling my kid (2nd grader) the other day about a war in heaven with good
vs. bad angels. Good angels kicked-out the bad ones. The bad ones, led by
Satan, wanted to take over.

He had a good question I never thought about- can angels die?

Theology says no- that's why hell was made for them. Forever tormented.

But here we have a case of war with no death? What are they doing- just shoving
each other around? Do they have weapons, but these weapons can't kill another?
What's a war without death? Are they cutting off limbs? If Angels don't have
limbs (because they are spiritual and not material), are they just being hurt in
some way, but not completely dying?

What does this have to do with ASA? It is a matter of trying to apply logic to
faith... does the Christian faith make sense about angel warfare and the fall of
Satan, using modern day logic?

He asks a lot of interesting questions that somehow adults gloss over (including
myself). Maybe we jump too fast to the standard line "I don't know, but one day
we'll find out in heaven." Is that line a short-circuit for logic and truthful
understanding?

...Bernie

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexanian, Moorad [mailto:alexanian@uncw.edu]
Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 12:36 PM
To: Dehler, Bernie
Cc: ASA
Subject: RE: [asa] ID/Miracles/Design (Behe vs. Behe)

Let us not forget the fall of Satan before that of man.

Moorad

-----Original Message-----
From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On Behalf
Of Dehler, Bernie
Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 3:32 PM
Cc: ASA
Subject: RE: [asa] ID/Miracles/Design (Behe vs. Behe)

Dick said:
"If good, functioning, workable "designs" are due to God's handiwork, then
 who or what is responsible for the flaws, defects and failures? Give
 God all the responsibilty or none of it."

Haminists (followers of Ken Ham and his interpretation) say that God made it all
good- but man's sin wrecked it. Before the fall, there were no mosquitos, or
they probably didn't drink blood back when they were first made, just like the
first lions, bears, etc. didn't eat other animals either (no animal death before
the fall, and all people were vegetarians until after the flood). So God gets
credit for good; man's sin is the reason for bad (or corruption of the good
design).

...Bernie

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Received on Wed Apr 29 16:52:42 2009