Re: [asa] The God hypothesis- a test

Moorad,

Well, Gideon put God to the test repeatedly and he is in the Faith Hall Of
Fame (Hebrews 11). It is a non-trivial topic.

David Heddle
Associate Professor of Physics
Christopher Newport University, &
The Thomas Jefferson National Accelerator Facility
http://helives.blogspot.com

On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 12:54 PM, Alexanian, Moorad <alexanian@uncw.edu>
wrote:

> It seems to me that a God test nullifies the need for faith and so such
> tests are nonexistent. It is a bit like wanting experimentally to violate
> Heisenberg's uncertainly principle.
>
>
> Moorad
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu on behalf of Dehler, Bernie
> Sent: Fri 5/16/2008 10:24 AM
> To: asa@calvin.edu
> Subject: RE: [asa] The God hypothesis- a test
>
>
>
> So RC, suppose you were able to hand-pick the test groups. Group 1 was
> Christians, trained in prayer as you suggest. Group 2 is avowed
> atheists. Group 3 is a control group mixed with unknown people. Do you
> think you could conduct a test to show that God is real because he
> answers pray, even sometimes, and show it statistically?
>
> Also, if you could do such a test, would it displease God? Jesus said
> "don't put the Lord your God to the test" when tested by Satan in the
> desert. But in Malachi God says "test me in this..." in regards to
> tithing; and in Isaiah he mocks those who are superstitious and says
> "come let us reason together." My atheist friend said something
> interesting, that God doesn't want to be tested because He's not there,
> and a test would prove it. Would God be insulted or displeased in a
> test of his existence? By the way, people who debate and show evidence
> of God using logic, such as William Lane Craig and others (like CS
> Lewis), isn't that a way of "testing God" to see if He holds water
> logically? The assumption is that if God didn't pass "logical tests"
> then He wouldn't be worth believing in, like the invisible pink unicorn
> or the flying spaghetti monster.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: RC Metcalf [mailto:rcmetcalf@thinkagain.us]
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 6:19 AM
> To: Dehler, Bernie; asa@calvin.edu
> Subject: Re: [asa] The God hypothesis- a test
>
> I have yet to see a scientific test designed to study the efficacy of
> prayer
> that is able to control all outside factors. I don't think such a test
> is
> possible, which is why I think testing for God's existence from
> sociobiologic prayer studies is misguided. There are other, more
> reasonable, methods of testing for God's existence.
>
> If you consider the biblical criteria for prayer suggested by the late
> 19th
> century Princeton theologian Charles Hodge, the inadequacy of prayer
> studies
> becomes self evident. Hodge said effective payer must exhibit:
>
> 1. Sincerity
> 2. Reverence
> 3. Humility
> 4. Importunity
> 5. Submission
> 6. Faith
> 7. Asking in the name of Christ
>
> Dawkins, Harris and Stenger all cite the same prayer study in their
> books.
> If I recall accurately, that study had people in various cities in the
> country pray for people they didn't know, except by first name. Even if
>
> every other factor existed, I submit that it is impossible to pray with
> sincerity and importunity under such circumstances. I think many modern
>
> Christians have adopted a more lackadaisical approach to prayer than we
> ought, hence we aren't as apt to recognize the importance of importunity
> in
> our prayer life unless we're thrown into the middle of a dire situation
> and
> the target of our prayers is someone dear to us.
>
> Blessings,
> RC
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dehler, Bernie" <bernie.dehler@intel.com>
> To: <asa@calvin.edu>
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 11:24 PM
> Subject: [asa] The God hypothesis- a test
>
>
> Hi all-
>
> A scientific question about God. Is it possible to test for the
> existence of the Christian God? Here's a scenario.
>
> Hypothesis: Those who are born-again Christians are born of the Spirit
> and have a new relationship with God. They can pray to God, and God
> will sometimes answer their prayers.
>
> Test: Take two groups. One group has self-identified born-again
> Christians, the other are self-described atheists. Both groups
> write-down their goals (career, medical needs, etc.) The Christian prays
> for their needs, while the atheist doesn't. Then see if there is a
> statistical difference. (This is a broad outline; a real test would
> have much tighter rules and controls.)
>
> If God exists, wouldn't this "catch Him in the act?" Is this a valid
> test and hypothesis? I'm vaguely aware that some have actually tried
> such a hypothesis/test (similar) and saw no statistical difference. If
> there's no difference between the groups, does that mean that either God
> doesn't exist, or God doesn't care (as Jesus taught that God our father
> cares for us)?
>
>
>
>
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Received on Fri May 16 13:06:39 2008