Re: [asa] E.O. Wilson "Baptist No More"

NO! Revelation 21-22 is not about a "recapitulation of Eden." The image is of a city for heaven's sake (pun intended), not a garden. Sure, the tree of life is there because that's where it belongs - it's an eschatological entity. The tree of life is the cross, not something bearing literal fruit.

The whole idea that the goal of salvation is a return to some golden age of primordial existence is a denial of God's intention that time be a part of creation & thus that the world have a history. It's like all the other cyclic world views which try to escape "the terror of history" (Eliade). Sure, there are uses of that Urzeit - Endzeit theme in the Bible but they are subordinated to the understanding that God intends from the beginning that creation have a history, that God's purposes are worked out in history, & that history is to be saved, not escaped from. That's why "the glory and honor of the nations" are brought into the city in Rev.21.

Shalom
George
http://web.raex.com/~gmurphy/
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: David Opderbeck
  To: Merv
  Cc: asa@calvin.edu
  Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 8:44 AM
  Subject: Re: [asa] E.O. Wilson "Baptist No More"

  Merv said: Or, rather, if there is a hint of mockery or critical self-questioning, it is directed at our modern way regarding truth.

  The cherub with the flaming sword, the reappearance of the tree of life in Rev. 22, have always fascinated me. Clearly, Rev. 22 is representing a recapitulation of Eden. IMHO, this is a major challenge to a thorough-going TE position -- not just in terms of the doctrine of scripture, but also theologically. What is the hope of Rev. 22 if the heavenly city recapitulates the hardscrabble existence of a tribe of neolithic farmers?

  We could think of the Genesis cherub as symbolic of humanity's broken relationship with God. Usually, however, angels in scripture don't seem to be presented as symbols. I've often wondered whether there's something even deeper and more mysterious going on here. Is Eden, like heaven, a "place" that is accessible to angels but dimensionally inaccessible to us? Does the fall represent a rending of planes of existence that were once unified and that are to be unified again? Strange ideas, but there are stranger ideas both in modern theoretical physics and in ancient near eastern and second-temple Jewish apocalyptic thought.

  On Nov 28, 2007 10:43 PM, Merv <mrb22667@kansas.net> wrote:

    Jon Tandy wrote:
      Wasn't the tree of life (Rev 22:19) in the Garden of Eden? Where did it go after that? Or was that scripture a non-scientific (non-biological) statement about two trees in the garden?

       Jon Tandy
    And for that matter, how long did the cherubim stand guard with the flaming sword? Presumably the tree of life was eventually transplanted (without apparent fanfare) to a less accessible local (like ... not on this planet), or maybe it was destroyed, and the cherubim released from his mundane guard duty? At least nobody in later history attempted any encounters with any stubborn angelic swordsman that we've heard about.

    These are the types of questions where the mismatch between the truth of Scripture and the method of modern "factual" analysis seems so obvious as to sound like a mockery when it is applied. But I don't mean it that way. Or, rather, if there is a hint of mockery or critical self-questioning, it is directed at our modern way regarding truth.

    --Merv

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Received on Thu Nov 29 09:38:54 2007