Re: [asa] proving god

From: Don Winterstein <dfwinterstein@msn.com>
Date: Sat Nov 24 2007 - 18:31:25 EST

A few potshots...

1) "The forms of life started with plant life..." Actually, bacteria. Cyanobacteria, which were prevalent, may be considered rudimentary plants, but it's still a bit misleading to say plants were first. Cyanobacteria are not plants in the sense most people think of, and many rudimentary animals existed (cf. Cambrian explosion) long before land plants came on the scene.

2) "The universe is full of bits and pieces ...released by the Big Bang. ... When they get to earth, we call them meteorites." Actually, meteors come from much later generations of matter than the Big Bang. BB generated mostly H, Li and He. Most heavier elements were generated in massive stars and released subsequently in supernovas.

3) "Evaporated water is present in the atmosphere." Duh. If liquid water is present in large bodies on Earth's surface, water vapor's got to be present in the atmosphere.

4) "...Our sun and most of the other stars have been releasing heat for almost 15 billion years!" Star ages vary all over the place, and our sun's age is thought to be a bit less than 5 billion years.

 5) "...Uranium ...can fission. That is what is happening in the suns of our universe. It might also be happening in the core of the earth...." Solar energy originates in fusion, not fission. Uranium (235) no doubt undergoes fission where it exists in the crust, but whatever is going on in Earth's core is nothing like solar fusion.

6) "Nuclear ... is the only source of power that has been found so far that can take up the energy slack that will certainly develop when our fossil
fuels run out." Like it or not, barring technological breakthroughs, coal is the most likely large-scale alternative. It's of course a fossil fuel, but it's not going to run out for quite some time. Nuclear will run out first.

7) "So how did science prove GOD?????? ...there must have been a super-intelligence guiding the development of man -GOD!!!!!" This is what we believe, but science didn't prove it. Science has teased out a lot of the detail.

Don

----- Original Message -----
  From: j burg
  To: asa@calvin.edu
  Sent: Saturday, November 24, 2007 1:17 PM
  Subject: [asa] proving god

  I'd like comments on an article written by a friend of mine, a chemist.

  I take issue with the idea of "proving," but are there other debatable points?

  burgy

   SCIENCE HAS FINALLY PROVED GOD!

  In the past several generations science has found that the
  DNA in every cell of the human body has a complete blueprint
  of the individual involved. It was recently announced that
  the DNA sequence in chromosome 22 has been 97% deciphered
  and that it contains over 34 million segments. What a
  complicated system - and chromosome 22 is one of the smaller
  of the 24 chromosomes that we all have! More recently
  science has also found that this same system of DNA also
  applies to other animals and even plants! The recent
  "cloning of the sheep - Dolly- was basically "proof' that
  the system works. DNA from an adult cell was transferred to
  an egg, which then developed, into an identical "Dolly".
  Subsequently, researchers have succeeded in cloning other
  mammals such as mice.

  Do we accept Science's theory that it all started with a
  "BIG BANG" about 15 billion years ago? Reading between the
  lines in Genesis, and granting that the "time line" of
  Genesis was different from our way of measuring time today,
  then the idea of having our "world" develop in six
  "days"(periods of time) brings the Biblical narrative and
  the Evolutionary theory into close agreement. When God
  inspired the writing of the Bible some 6000 or so years ago,
  man certainly was not intellectually developed enough to
  understand more than was presented in Genesis.

  If we look at the evolutionary idea where 15 billion years
  ago it all started with a Big Bang, everything was certainly
  "formless and empty" at that point in time. The scientific
  approach says that life slowly evolved. The Bible says that
  the first step was the separation of light from darkness.
  Science says that after the Big Bang, the matter that was
  going away from the place of the Bang, slowly coalesced into
  stars and planets. When the earth formed, it eventually
  started rotating
  once a day! When parts of the earth face the Sun - around
  which we are in orbit ~ it is Day. When
  we don't face the sun - it is night.

  On up the line, the biblical and scientific explanations go
  hand in hand. The forms of life started with plant life,
  then animal life, and finally- the most complicated - MAN -
  evolved!!!

  If we were given the job of designing an earth where human
  and other life could survive and flourish, man - even the
  best genius that could be put on the job - could scarcely
  have covered all of the bases that have been covered to make
  the earth a habitable place for life. To whit:

  I. Life forms need an environment of approximately 0-100F to
  survive. We have it. How does it happen??
  A. The 24 hour day allows warming during the day and cooling
  at night.
  B. Exposure to the sun on some of the other planets that we
  have observed has resulted in environments that reach
  several hundred degrees. We could never make it there!
  C. About 70 % of the earth's surface is water. Each day, the
  water is evaporated to absorb heat. Each night the
  evaporated water condenses to form clouds and release heat.
  Water is a unique substance. Nothing else on the earth has
  as great a capacity for heat transfer. Was this an
  accident???
  D. With 70% of the earth's surface in water; we have a
  tremendous heat reservoir which contributes to moderating
  the temperature of the earth.
  E. The earth's atmosphere contributes to making the earth
  habitable in many ways:

  1. The universe is full of bits and pieces of the matter
  that were released by the Big Bang. Many of these come
  earthward each day. When they get to earth, we call them
  meteorites. There have been a few real big ones in
  geological history - like the one that hit some 65 million
  years ago and wiped out all of the dinosaurs - and probably
  most of the other life that was around at that time!!
  Fortunately for us, most of the meteorites are small enough
  to burn up in the atmosphere.

  2. The atmosphere is about 20% oxygen and 80% nitrogen with
  a fraction of a percent carbon dioxide tossed in for good
  measure. All animal life depends on oxygen for its
  existence. Plant life depends on carbon dioxide. Was it just
  by accident that animals take in oxygen and release carbon
  dioxide, while plants take in carbon dioxide and release
  oxygen??? What a neat arrangement! ! !! Accident??

  3. The radiation from the sun is loaded with harmful
  ultraviolet radiation. The upper atmosphere has just enough
  ozone to absorb the ultraviolet radiation before it reaches
  us and does its dirty work.

  4. Evaporated water is present in the atmosphere. Were it
  not for this water, animal skin would get hard and flake
  away. We all know how much more of a problem we have with
  dry skin in the arid west as compared with more humid areas.

  II. Our sun has been supplying heat to the solar system
  ever since it coalesced and became a "sun" some time after
  the Big Bang. There are billions of other "suns" out there
  in the universe. Every time we make a bigger telescope, the
  more universes we can see and the more stars there are! At
  this point science says the universe is still expanding at
  an ever-increasing rate and we estimate that the Big Bang
  was 15 billion years ago. That means that our sun and most
  of the other stars have been releasing heat for almost 15
  billion years! Why haven't they run out of fuel???? A few
  have. Every once and a while, we observe a Supernova - which
  is postulated to be a star that has run its course and
  finally burned out. How have the stars - and our sun -
  lasted so long?? In this past century a genius named
  Einstein figured out that it is possible for mass to be
  converted to energy at the rate of E=MC squared. This is a
  fantastic ratio. A piece of uranium the size of a pea can
  fission and produce as much heat as a ton of coal. That is
  what is happening in the suns of our universe. It might also
  be happening in the core of the earth - but we don't really
  know yet.

  III. Our civilization has developed and grown over the past
  several hundred years because of fossil fuel and minerals
  that man has been able to locate and mine for our use. One
  of these days these fossil fuels and minerals will run out
  and we will have to develop substitutes. Many of our mineral
  items have been replaced by new man-made materials. Our
  biggest shortfall in the next fifty years will be fossil
  fuel for heat and electricity. Nuclear power - invented in
  the USA and now in decline in the USA (because of some of
  our misguided environmental evangelists) is the only source
  of power that has been found so far that can take up the
  energy slack that will certainly develop when our fossil
  fuels run out. Wind power and water power are "Green" but
  quantity-wise will not make the grade.

  IV. So how did science prove GOD?????? Science believes in
  chance variation. If man developed by chance from
  rudimentary particles and molecules - which slowly evolved
  by chance - and man's individuality is governed by the DNA
  system which gives each individual 24 chromosomes - each of
  which contains MILLIONS of pieces of information in each
  cell that describe the individual - then there must have
  been a super-intelligence guiding the development of man -
  GOD!!!!!

  Then to ice the cake, we now find that there are millions of
  other species on earth - both plant and animal - which are
  controlled by the SAME DNA system. It might be that somehow
  in billions of years man developed under this system. Man
  has changed very little in the past few millenia that we
  have fossil evidence of, so man is not changing rapidly.
  BUT, if man did somehow evolve slowly in an evolutionary
  way, science would certainly agree that the same system
  could not have evolved in an identical way millions of other
  times! Only GOD could have done it - on his chosen EARTH.
  Man has been looking for extraterrestrial life for several
  generations - without success. I don't think there is any
  unless GOD decided to put another earth somewhere
  else!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  Francis Hutto, 2000

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Received on Sat Nov 24 18:37:26 2007

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