Date: Wed Jun 14 2006 - 01:50:02 EDT
At 12:59 AM 6/14/2006, Clarke Morledge wrote to Debbie:
>I am not sure that by saying "most cases of
>homosexuality appear to be physiological"
>carries the same force as suggesting that the
>evidence is "conclusive" regarding the causes of
>homosexuality. Should we not be a little more cautious?
>
>If the evidence is indeed conclusive that there
>is some sort of genetic cause of homosexuality,
>then it is quite clear that the bulk of
>evangelical Christianity is not aware of it. ....
@ From the horses' mouths themselves - doing
their own "peer reviews". Janice.
Bio - Tammy Bruce is openly gay ... was drawn
into feminist activism in the late 1980's ... was
elected president of the Los Angeles chapter of
NOW at the age of 27. The youngest ever to
achieve that position, she doubled the chapter's
membership from 2,000 to 4,000 within a year
...seven years as president (1990-1996, the
longest continuous tenure in the chapter's 30
year history) ...also served two years as a
member of the National NOW board of directors.
http://tammybruce.com/biography.php
The Tammy Bruce interview - by John Hawkins
Excerpted:
John Hawkins: A related question, I guess you
would have been pretty surprised when you said in
the book that while Christians "hold religious
beliefs against homosexuality," they are some of
the most tolerant, understanding, and kind people
I have ever met.” So was that a big surprise for
you when you weren’t getting condemned?
Tammy Bruce: Yes, it was; it was shocking. For me
it was quite life-changing in my sense of how I
viewed the world and I was also, when it comes to
my view of Christians, quite surprised by how
happy they were. I mean, I remember being on the
left; no one is happy, trust me. They (are the)
biggest group of miserable people you would ever
want to meet. Everything is wrong, everything is
going bad, everyone is after you, everyone wants
to get you, people are building camps.
To speak with finally, on talk radio, with
Christians, I was struck first by the genuine
happiness from these people and also the fact
that even though they disagreed with me, finally
I was having conversations with people who were
curious, disagreed with me, but didn’t want to
hurt me, were interested in persuading me, and it
was quite a revelation, I have to say. I owe my
beginning in talk radio to that kind of --- it’s
the only place really where you can have that
kind of exchange between someone like myself and
conservative Christians and have it be safe and
have it be really life-transforming.
John Hawkins: Let me ask a related question to
this because I thought this was kind of
fascinating because it’s so different from what
you often hear. In the book, you were talking
about how you came to decide that you wanted to
be a lesbian and you pretty much framed it in
those terms. It was a choice. You were attracted
to men and women and you chose to --- you just
liked women better --- would you say that’s common or....
Tammy Bruce: Well, it’s difficult to say because
it’s so politically incorrect to ask these
questions. It’s one of the reasons why – and I’ve
made that discussion in the epilogue – so
that...parents (could allow) their children (to read) at their discretion.
I felt that it was finally time in a book about
individualism to discuss the two things that
really differentiate me from a number of my
listeners and readers and, of course, that’s one
of those aspects. Normally it would be a very
private part of my life, but since I’m public, it
becomes important because of the nature of my
position on issues and what I stand for.
In that regard, I thought being honest and this,
of course, is key (to) that when it comes to
homosexuality. There is such a variety, at least
within the community itself, ...about why women
identify as lesbians, but even what that means.
There are a number of women who identify as
lesbians, some of them, somewhat well-known, have
regular liaisons with men. ...There are some
women in the community that you could get to
know...who’ve experienced violence at the hands
of men and have turned to women for that reason.
There are other women who say that they’ve been
gay since they’ve been born and that, of course,
is also politically incorrect to question or to
ask them how or why they know that.
...I challenge and suggest that the gay label is
rejected by homosexuals who don’t want to be
associated with left wing politics, which is also
what it stands for these days. I’ve always taken
issue with this demand and this comes into
conformity again -- the conformity demand by the
left, that if you’re a homosexual you’d better
identify as gay, you’d better say it is an
orientation, that it’s not a preference, that all
of these singular lines should be adhered to so that you have a united front.
Well, I say bunk with that and how absurd that
the community that says that it is the most
different and the most unique demands such
serious conformity on its own members. So I think
it’s certainly time for some level of honesty in
that discussion about the nature of it...
John Hawkins: Can you tell us a little bit about
..." More: http://www.rightwingnews.com/interviews/bruce.php
*
Ex-homosexuals have a web
site: http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Root_Problems.htm
[]
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>Survey on Root Causes
They say opposites attract.
That maxim, in the very simplest of terms,
explains much about our former homosexual
condition and how we were able to uncover the underlying problems creating it.
As long as we felt that men were the opposite
from us, while we identified with women as our
sisters, we remained attracted to our opposite --
the mysterious, unknown masculine. To us, it
often felt like men were the opposite sex, so
being sexually attracted to them felt natural.
Initially, at least, we didn't feel homosexual so
much as we felt genderless and, lacking
sufficient maleness within ourselves, attracted
to that which we felt would make us feel masculine and whole.
Every man has a masculine drive. In our case,
that drive inadvertently became sexualized. But
we also found it could become desexualized as we
fulfilled that masculine drive in more emotionally grounded ways.
We discovered the path to healing as we came to
understand that, at least in our case, our
homosexual feelings were not the problem but were
actually symptoms of deeper, underlying problems
and long-buried pain that usually had little or
nothing to do with erotic desire. Rather, they
had to do with our self-identity, self-esteem
(especially our "gender esteem"), relationships
and spiritual life. Once we discovered and healed
the underlying pain, the symptoms of
homosexuality began to take care of themselves.
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>Survey on Root Causes
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>In
2004, People Can Change surveyed the members of
its online support groups to determine what they
perceived to have been the most significant
causes of their developing homosexual feelings in
their own lives. We asked about 25 possible
factors -- everything from biology to personal
choice. More than 200 men responded.
To view the survey summary, click
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>here.
(Keep in mind that this is not a survey of the
beliefs of the general "gay" population -- those
who have accepted a gay identity and are happy in
that life. Rather, it is a survey of the beliefs
of those who are seeking to overcome or minimize
homosexual desires. Gays may or may not answer these questions differently.)
1. Father-son relationship problems: In the
survey, 97% said problems in the father-son
relationship while they were growing up
contributed to their developing same-sex
attractions (SSA) -- and men usually identified
it as one of the three most significant factors.
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>(See
especially page 6 of the survey.)
* It seems very rare for a man who struggles
with homosexuality to feel that he was
sufficiently loved, affirmed and mentored by his
father growing up, or that he identified with his
father as a male role model. Oftentimes the
father-son relationship is marked by either
actual or perceived abandonment, extended
absence, hostility or disinterest (a form of abandonment).
* Like all human experience, this is not
universal, and sometimes the father-son
relationship doesn't seem to have been a problem.
Rather, the relationship with brothers or male
peers or male abusers may have created deep
wounding. Whatever the source of the
estrangement, it is a common experience for many
of us to have felt a deep longing to be held, to
be loved by a father figure, to be mentored into
the world of men and to have our masculine natures affirmed by other men.
2. Conflict with male peers: The same percentage
of men who said father-son problems contributed
to their SSA -- 97% -- also said problems in
their male-peer relationships contributed. And
half said it was one of the "top three" factors.
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>(See
especially page 7 of the survey.)
* Somehow, even as boys or young teenagers,
we felt like we were never "man enough." We felt
like we didn't live up to the masculine ideal. We
saw ourselves as too fat or too skinny, too short
or too awkward, not athletic enough or tough or
strong or good-looking enough -- or whatever
other qualities we admired in other males but
judged to be lacking in ourselves. It was more
than low self-esteem, it was low gender esteem --
a deficiency in our core sense of gender upon
which our whole self image is built. Other males
just seemed naturally masculine, but masculinity
never came naturally to us. We aspired to it but
were mystified by how to achieve it. Among other
males, we felt different and lonely.
* Feeling deficient as males, we pined to be
accepted and affirmed by others, especially those
whose masculinity we admired most. We began to
idolize the qualities in other males that we
judged to be lacking in ourselves. Idolizing them
widened the gulf we imagined between ourselves
and so-called "real men." In idolizing them, we
increased our sense of our own masculine
deficiency. At the same time that we idolized
certain male traits or maleness generally, many
of us came to fear other boys and men. Born with
unusually sensitive and gentle personalities, we
found it was easy for many of us to feel
different from and rejected by our more
rough-and-tumble peers growing up. We came to
fear their taunts and felt like we could never
belong. Many of us feared the sports field and
felt like we could never compete. Many of us felt
rejected by our fathers and feared that we could
never measure up or would never really matter to them.
* So where did this leave us, as males
ourselves? It left us in a Neverland of gender
confusion, not fully masculine but not really
feminine either. We had disassociated not just
from individual men we feared would hurt us, but
from the entire heterosexual male world. Some of
us even detached from our very masculinity as something shameful and inferior.
3. Mother-son relationships (and the "smothering
mother" syndrome): Nine out of 10 survey
respondents said aspects of their relationships
with their mothers contributed to their SSA.
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>(See
especially page 8 of the survey.)
* Even as we perceived our fathers as
abandoning, ignoring or being hostile toward us,
it was a common experience for us to
over-identify with or become overly dependent on
our mothers. Oftentimes, we never fully cut the
"apron strings" that attached our identity to
hers. Mom often became our confidant and mentor
instead of Dad. But Mom could never show us how
to act and think like a man. So it was common for
us to view maleness from a woman's perspective
instead of a man's. We inadvertently adopted a
woman's view of the world. The gulf between us
and the world of men was widened and reinforced.
* Feeling alienated from the male world, we
often found comfort in female companionship. Some
of us labeled women and femininity as superior to
men and masculinity because we perceived females
as more sensitive, accepting and loving. They
felt "safer" to be with and to expose our painful
emotions to. Instead of ridiculing our sensitive
natures, they appreciated them. They didn't
expect us to prove we were "man enough," even
while we were still just boys. Many of us learned
to identify with women and girls as our sisters,
our buddies and, inadvertently, even our role
models. Our sense of girls as the "same sex" and
boys as the "opposite" sex was reinforced.
4. Sexual abuse: 48% of respondents said that, as
children or youth, they had been sexually abused
by an older or more powerful person. Usually it
was by a male, and in those cases, 96% considered
the abuse to have contributed to their developing
SSA feelings.
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>(See
especially pages 8 and 9 of the survey.)
5. Other sexual experiences: 93% said they had
had other sexual experiences -- including
pornography, sexual fantasy and sex play with
other boys -- as children or youth, and of those
who did, 93% said they believed these experiences
contributed to their SSA feelings.
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>(See
especially page 9 of the survey.)
6. Personality traits: 87% said they believed
their personality traits were a contributing
factor.
<http://www.peoplecanchange.com/Surveyoncauses.pdf>(See
especially page 10 of the survey.)
* A great many of us were born with or
developed an innate sensitivity and emotional
intensity that we learned could be both a
blessing and a curse. On the one hand, our
sensitivity caused us to be more loving, gentle,
kind and oftentimes spiritually inclined than average.
* On the other hand, these were some of the
very traits that caused our more rough-and-tumble
male peers to taunt us, girls to welcome us into
their inner circles, moms to hold onto us more
protectively, and dads to distance themselves
from us. Perhaps even more problematic, it
created within us a thin-skinned susceptibility
to feeling hurt and rejected, thus magnifying
many times over whatever actual rejection and
offense we might have received at the hands of
others. Our perception became our reality.
Homosexual Consequences
These and other hurts were oftentimes the
problems buried below the surface. Complex,
interwoven and painful, they drove us to
homosexual relationships in an attempt to find
healing. But we found that, for us, acting on
these homosexual desires actually worsened rather
than lessened the underlying problems.
Homosexuality, for us, wasn't the solution; it
was an escape from solving the real problems that
had caused the symptoms to begin with.
Time alone could never really heal these kinds of
deep wounds without our going back to face them,
acknowledge them, grieve them, release our
legitimate anger over them, take steps to repair
the damage they had caused us (to the extent we
could), and finally, to forgive and move on.
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