RE: In defense of Paul Seely

Hi Glenn:
 
Does anyone else see your response as a smokescreen, or is it only me?
Are you such a good con man that this kind of non-response actually
fools people? Are you really that good? I talk about the lack of human
beings at the time of your flood and you talk about brain size. I
mention building a massive ark capable of holding animals and you
counter that early man could across rivers. I said your hypothetical
"ark" couldn't rise above sea level and you jump to some argument about
Mount Ararat, Agri Dagh, which I have never named as a possible landing
site, in fact have argued against. See how you are. You obfuscate.
Let me state the problem a little differently. If someone said Leaf
Erickson was the first to fly a plane across the Atlantic, we could note
that Vikings aren't contemporaneous with airplanes. The Flintstones
cartoon mixes dinosaurs with Homo sapiens which we know isn't possible
as bidedal mammals such as ourselves are separated by roughly 60 million
years from dinosaurs. Are you with me so far?
Following this line of reasoning, your infilling of the Mediterranean
Sea occurred at 5.5 million years ago. It must have taken longer than
one year to do it, and at a time when our species had not yet evolved.
There were no "men" to sin. Only apes lived at that time in geological
history. Even if a split between what has since become human from what
eventually became chimpanzees did occur at 6 million years ago, the line
which became human were still apes long after the split. No biological
"humanoids" occur in the fossil record earlier than 2.2 million years
ago. This puts a massive split of over 3 million years between your
"flood" to the advent of our genus "Homo." I would like to hear your
argument as to how "sin" spread from non-humans to humans.
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/afarensis/a
farensis-a.html> Australopithecus ramidus 5 to 4 million years BC
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/afarensis/a
farensis-a.html> Australopithecus afarensis 4 to 2.7 million years BC
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/africanus/a
fricanus-a.html> Australopithecus africanus 3.0 to 2.0 million years
BC
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/robustus/ro
bustus-a.html> Australopithecus robustus 2.2 to 1.0 million years BC
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/habilis/hab
ilis-a.html> Homo habilis 2.2 to 1.6 million
years BC
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/erectus/ere
ctus-a.html> Homo erectus 2 to 0.4 million years
BC
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/h-sapiens/h
-sapiens-a.html> Homo sapiens- 400,000 to 200,000
years BC
HS neandertalensis 200,000 to 30,000 years BC
 
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/h-sapiens-s
apiens/h-sapiens-sapiens-a.html> Homo sapiens sapiens
<http://www.wsu.edu/gened/learn-modules/top_longfor/timeline/h-sapiens-s
apiens/h-sapiens-sapiens-a.html> 130,000 years BC to present
You complain about lack of evidence of flood deposits far enough North
on the upper Tigris, although I don't know of any digging to confirm
this, and yet you have no problem with the absence of evidence of any
elements of civilization among our brachiating forebears. Your finding
of simple bone flutes, which by no stretch can be construed as "harps"
(Gen. 4:21), still gives you a gap of 5 million years from any type of
civilized society which Genesis describes! You don't see that as a
problem?
If you read the description in Genesis of the conversations Adam and Eve
had with God, and these conversations occurred over 5 million years ago,
you must presume that God had decided to make eternal life available for
non-humans, that non-humans were capable of conversations with God, and
that they had all the elements of civilization, heretofore undiscovered,
that archaeologists concur arose in greater Mesopotamia, the fertile
crescent - datable to no earlier than 10,000 years ago.
Here is my suggestion. Why don't you shift your totally impossible
timeline to the infilling of Lake Van, roughly 10,000 years ago? Here
is an entire rationale for that.
 <http://www.accuracyingenesis.com/flood.html>
http://www.accuracyingenesis.com/flood.html
At least there you wouldn't have the incredible timing problem you have
now. At least you would have some semblance of being right and you have
others with you in the same boat, so to speak.
The only motive I can see for your tilting at windmills is that you are
trying to line Adam up with the man/ape split and shoehorn something
into the flood slot demanded by Genesis. I applaud your perseverance,
even in the absence of any sensible coherence. At least it should be
apparent (to nearly everyone but you and Hugh Ross) that Adam cannot be
aligned with the man/ape split using the commonly-accepted
anthropological date as I have argued for twenty years. Placing Adam in
the flow of mankind, rather than at the apex, puts Bible, science and
history all together. That should count for something. And Eridu in
southern Mesopotamia fits all the historical evidence for a Garden of
Eden.
In sum, all the historical evidence fits a southern Mesopotamian
surrounding for Adam and Eve, the Genesis Flood, and the Tower of Babel
incident no earlier than 10,000 years ago. You can't begin to explain
ziggurats at 5 million years ago.
(BTW, the Sumerians commenced their ancestral line with the creation of
a "Tagtug" out of clay in Dilmun, probably Bahrain in the Persian Gulf.
Jews aren't descended from the Sumerians, however, so Genesis sums up
their arrival.)
Now to your questions:
Where in the Bible does it tell us what Adam looked like?
Where does it say that sin emanated from non-human ancestors?
Where in the Bible does it say that the image of God is reserved for
those who look like us?
Well, it does imply that the "image" is for humans.
Now, what are small brained guys capable of doing?
By "guys" you mean human guys do you not?
I would also like to point out that mankind has been crossing bodies of
water for over 3 million years.
I must be behind in my anthropology as you suggest. What eminent
anthropologist extends "mankind" beyond 3 million years? Let me remind
you that the "pith" in Australopithicus means "ape."
Shoot Dick, you don't even need most of the brain you don't use! ;-)
Here's a point I'll concede!
Yeah Dick, it is sad how you haven't learned a thing in the past 10
years. Is there any medicine available for your condition?
Yes, it's called Aricept. Write that down. You may need it when you
get to be my age. But it only helps memory, it won't replace common
sense :>).
Dick Fischer
Dick Fischer, Genesis Proclaimed Association
Finding Harmony in Bible, Science, and History
 <http://www.genesisproclaimed.org> www.genesisproclaimed.org

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Received on Sun Jun 11 13:34:09 2006