Re: Dembski theodicy

I'd be a little careful here. It seems that Romans 8 does say something
about the physical universe, as it seems to encompasses all of creation. It
does seem to imply a teleology to the creation, with the present stage
reflecting a time during which God's full purposes have not yet been
realized.

On 5/11/06, drsyme@cablespeed.com <drsyme@cablespeed.com> wrote:
>
> Exactly.
>
> So there is no reason to think that "creation" meaning the
> physical universe is waiting to be "liberated from its
> bondage to decay and brought into the glorious freedom of
> the children of God."
>
> On Thu, 11 May 2006 13:49:08 -0500
> Keith Miller <kbmill@ksu.edu> wrote:
> > David Opderbeck wrote:
> >
> >> Perhaps a more productive way consider things like
> >>hurricanes and
> >> earthquakes is to separate the happening of such events
> >>from their
> >> effects on human beings. We could conceive of a world
> >>in which such
> >> events would happen in the ordinary course of nature,
> >>but human beings
> >> would not suffer because of their happening. Partly
> >>this could result
> >> from perfect justice, communication and cooperation
> >>among humans. For
> >> example, hurricane Katrina would not have wiped out the
> >>impoverished
> >> and de facto racially segregated neighborhoods in New
> >>Orleans because
> >> poverty and segregation would not exist, there would be
> >>no corruption
> >> relating to hurricane-safe building codes, government
> >>officials would
> >> respond effectively with evacuation plans, and so on.
> >>Partly this
> >> also could result from perfect fellowship and
> >>communication between
> >> humans and God, such that God could communicate directly
> >>with a fully
> >> responsive community about how to prepare for such
> >>events. In other
> >> words, sin didn't change ordinary natural processes so
> >>much as it
> >> destroyed the perfect community and fellowship among
> >>humans, and
> >> between humans and God, that would have precluded any
> >>human suffering
> >> resulting from those events. For anyone more deeply
> >>read on theodicy,
> >> is there any strand of theodicy that proceeds along
> >>similar lines?
> >
> > Yes, this is precisely my position. The Fall was a
> >disruption of the relationships between God and humans,
> > among humans, and between humans and the creation.
> > Hurricanes and earthquakes are not evil or a consequence
> >of evil, but the human estrangement from God turns them
> >into human disasters.
> >
> > Keith
> >
> >
>
>
Received on Thu May 11 19:25:25 2006