Re: a question for monists

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:46:50 -0500 Jan de Koning <jan@dekoning.ca>
writes:
> At 03:14 PM 3/29/2005, D. F. Siemens, Jr. wrote:
> > >
> >Jan,
> >I think you've confused two senses of 'eternal'. God is eternal in
> the
> >sense of being timeless and so, in the traditional understanding,
> >sees/knows everything within the created realm, which open theology
> and
> >process theology deny. The normal theology requires being infinite
> to be
> >eternal in this sense, a characteristic of the Godhead, not of
> creatures.
> >The second sense is a matter of infinite time which, like the
> natural
> >numbers, has an end which can never be reached by counting or
> being. It
> >can, however, have a beginning. My eternal life, as I know it,
> began when
> >I placed my faith in Christ. In God's view, my eternal life was
> >foreknown. As a finite creature, I shall never attain to God's
> infinite,
> >timeless view. As a creature, I had a beginning. I could have an
> end if
> >God had not promised otherwise. But I can never become uncreated,
> without
> >beginning, infinite.
> >Davd
> >Dave
>
> That is exactly what I deny. You receive eternal life indeed when
> you
> place your faith in Christ. However, for now, you still live in
> time. When you are resurrected you will live in eternity, yes, but
> I
> believe that none of us know what "eternity" is. "Time" is also
> created by
> God> We live now in time When we die we have to wait in the grave
> until
> we are resurrected in "Eternity", but what "eternity" means none of
> us
> knows. I am convinced that it is not just "Time without end." I
> base that
> on 1 Thess. 4: 12-18.
>
> This is the last posting I will do for now on this subject, since if
> I
> continue, I will just have to repeat what I wrote before.
>
> Jan de Koning
>
>
I can't follow your reasoning. The term Paul uses is /pantote/--all +
adverb of time (=then). So the first meaning Thayer gives is "at all
times." If our joining with the Lord makes us timeless, then he must have
emptied himself and entered creation, subsequently abandoning his
connection to space-time-matter. Unless you have a passage that tells us
that this happened with or after the ascension, I conclude that his state
now is as it was during the 40 days, when he told Mary to let go, ate and
invited Thomas to test his body.
Dave
Received on Thu Mar 31 16:28:56 2005