Re: Free will and quantum mechanics (For Dr. Haarsma and anyone for that matter) In response to D. F. Siemens

You took the words out of my mouth. I was going to put that same thing but didn't.
I agree!

John

----- Original Message -----
From: "D. F. Siemens, Jr." <dfsiemensjr@juno.com>
To: john.hewlett@usa.com
Subject: Re: Free will and quantum mechanics (For Dr. Haarsma and anyone for that matter)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 20:27:31 -0700

>
>
> On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 20:49:22 -0500 "John Hewlett" <john.hewlett@usa.com>
> writes:
> > I have learned as someone has pointed out that the idea of free
> > will is kind of a grey area. One book that you might be
> > interested in (and I am reading it right now my self) is by
> > Walter J. Freeman J.r., he is a neuroscientist at Berkley. One of
> > the most best in the country probably. The book is called "How
> > Brains Make Up Their Minds" and I have not run into any QM in the
> > book. I would like to see some different approaches to the
> > free-will issue besides quantum approaches although I still find
> > the quantum approaches terribly interesting. Quantum approaches
> > have been around for a while. One is the Eccles/Beck approach.
> > Eccles being one of the greatest neurophysiologist of the century
> > and Beck a quantum physicist. Dr. Haarsma you of course know this
> > issue gives me some troubles as I have e-mailed you privatly
> > before. Thanks a bunch,
> > John
> >
> Let me throw in another aspect of freedom: there is no way to prove that
> one is free. Consider: Al in situation S with choice between A and B
> chooses A, says he did it freely. But Bob claims that Al had to choose A.
> Al replies that he'll show that it's his choice by going back to S and
> choosing B this time. But Al cannot go back to S, which did not have the
> choice of A in its background. The closest he can come is to something
> like S, call it S'--if it can even be that close.
>
> The only thing we have is that conviction that the human being's choice
> makes a difference. It underlies ascriptions of moral responsibility,
> rationality, the things that are distinctively human.
> Dave

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