RE: knowledge & proof [was "wee people"]

I believe that fasting loosens our filters, allowing more reality in.

Fasting is about paying attention. This is one of the 5 or 6 things
mentioned

in Hebrews warnings - needing to pay attention. My journal is littered
with

errors, but also with corrections filled in later and question marks of
still

mysterious relationships. I tend to do better at coming up with a
complete

list of things on a subject and totally disorganized in pegging how they
fit

together.

Here is my word-acrostic response to your qualms:

I - I EXPERIENCED SOMETHING NEW AND CONJECTURED IT'S WORTHY OF

                     INVESTIGATION FOR 80 DAYS AROUND THE WORLD.

BELIEVE - OBVIOUSLY, BELIEVE AND CAN PROVE ARE DIFFERENT.

THAT - IN MY CASE AT LEAST, HAVING SPENT 82 DAYS IN 3 EXPERIMENTAL

                       TRIALS WHICH RESULTS AGREED, I DISCOVERED
SOMETHING.

FASTING - WORKS FOR SOMEONE LIKE ME WITH VKA OR KVA PERSONALITY

- WHERE SOUND IS UNCONSCIOUS CREATIVITY. WOULD BIBLE

                        STUDY BE MORE APPROPRIATE IF KAV OR AKV ? WHAT
WOULD

                        BE APPROPRIATE FOR VAK AND AVK ?

LOOSENS - NOT AN ALL OR NOTHING THING MEASURE. IT'S A COST/BENEFIT

                              WEIGHING PROCESS THAT BROUGHT THIS
CONCLUSION.

OUR - I.E. I ASSUME I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE BENEFITTING, THERE IS A

                            TOGETHERNESS / MUTUALITY OF SYNERGY EFFECT

FILTERS - DIFFERENT FOLKS HAVE DIFFERENT KICK-OFF LEVELS AND DIFF

                            EXTREME BEARING LEVELS, A QUANDRY. HAVE TO
SEARCH.

COMMA - THE PACE, TIMING VARIES. PERHAPS YOU NEED TO SPEND ONE MONTH

                               ON EACH ITEM IN LIST. I WAS CONVINCED BY
1 DAY.

ALLOWING -- ALLOWANCE/ACCOMODATIONS NEEDS COULD VARY. THE FASTING

                                  WAS DONE ON VACATION TIME, THE OTHERS
WHILE WORKING.

MORE - MAY NOT BE BETTER. ALSO, ACTUALLY, I HAD SOME OVERLAP OF 5

                               DAYS, WHICH I NEGLECTED TO MENTION. IT
IS NOT INTENDED

                               TO BE TORMENT, BUT AN ENJOYMENT OF
BROADENING HORIZONS.

REALITY - THE GAP IS WIDE AND DEEP IN THE FINAL JUMP. ASSESS THE RISK -

                        ISN'T IT WORTH A TRY? I BELIEVE IN MULTIPLE
ALTERNATIVE

                        REALITIES OF SOME SORT.

 IN - BETWEEN TIMES, ARE THEY BORING FOR YOU? I HAVE RECEIVED A

                 CONSOLATION OF A MORE WHOLE-BRAIN ORIENTATION. I FOUND

                 A WAY FOR INTUITION, FEELINGS, COMMON SENSE,
REASONING,

                 INSTINCTS, AND IMAGINATION TO WORK TOGETHER
EFFECTIVELY.

PERIOD - PERIODIC TUNE-UPS? IT'S ANYBODY'S GUESSTIMATE. HOW MANY

                      LEVELS/LAYERS OF REALITY DO YOU SEE IN HEAVENLIES?

                      DOES IT LOOK LIKE JUST A 1-1 DEAL OR IS IT A
BOTH/AND

                      TRUSTWORTHY ALLIES AND ADVERSARIES DEAL?

-----Original Message-----
From: D. F. Siemens, Jr. [mailto:dfsiemensjr@juno.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 12:29 PM
To: Roberts, Joe
Cc: dfwinterstein@msn.com; asa@calvin.edu
Subject: Re: knowledge & proof [was "wee people"]

Please, Joe. Three times in your life you deliberately focused on
certain matters for several days running and you say this proves that
fasting connects you to reality? Concentrated thought had nothing to do
with it? This isn't even a plausible /post hoc/ presentation.

Dave

On Mon, 8 Nov 2004 17:52:16 -0600 "Roberts, Joe"
<Joe.Roberts@thecb.state.tx.us> writes:

        I have done 3 related things which I associate with Jesus
experience in the wilderness situation. However, I wasn't the purist and
didn't

        do it all in one piece.

           1. fasted on just grape juice just for a few days - this cut
down the noise from my bowels and I remembered how to feel rested like a
child among other things.

                     i.e. it relieved a LOT of stress. I began to notice
some things popping into my mind once in a while spontaneously which I
never would have anticipated.

                     This was the first time in my life that I became
aware of Old Testament things of benefit. It also contributed to what I
would call whole-brain thinking.

                      I read the book Whole-Brain Thinking a few years
later is how I got this interpretation.

           2. spent 30 days in a row "observing" with a different focus
each day according to a weird concocted PLANNED list, in a so-called
"ambassadorship for Christ"

                   journey, like a wilderness adventure, in conjunction
with following my normal routines as well, keeping a journal log. I
didn't notice much benefit during the

                   process, but it seemed to have a longterm effect,
like 26-27 days to learn a new habit. I committed initially to 30 days,
but I actually ended up doing 40

                   days. There are several good books that I would think
would be good motivators for such a thing, e.g. John Bevere or Rick
Warren.

           3. spent 37 days in INTENSE observation after many years,
which I felt was a continuation of the previous trip, and felt a might
presence every day and

                   right on the point of a new list with which I was
already more experienced and acquainted in using. This was done after I
recommended to my

                   daughters this wilderness trek idea and wanted to
prove to myself once again that it was worthwhile before I raised
expectations. The number 37

                   was inspired by Vernon Jenkins notions.

        The practice of journaling, in particular of LATER REVIEWING and
annotating changes in journals, works well with these concepts.

         
Received on Tue Nov 9 15:18:02 2004