Re: "Which comes first, the anatomic variation or the ability?"

No, I am not suggesting that, merely that new variants or mutations arose
and then were whittled away. That is exactly how nature appears to
function, per the examples I cited. The point is that we have evidence
of extinctions, and evidence of less specialized forms preceding more
specialized forms, and the cousins of many forms along the way dying out.

<drsyme@cablespeed.com> writes:
>Correct me if I misunderstand you please. It seems to me
>that in this idea of the "Divine Whittler" that you talk
>about, all genetic variation that currently exists, was
>there from the beginning, including many other variants
>that have been whittled away.
>
>This is quite a different concept from mutations bringing
>novel adaptations that increase surviveability, or at
>least increase an organisms chance of passing that
>mutation on.
>
>So as I understand your concept I think it is quite
>different than mutation and natural selection.
>
>
>
>
>On Wed, 03 Nov 2004 13:46:36 -0500
> "ed babinski" <ed.babinski@furman.edu> wrote:
>>"jack syme" <drsyme@cablespeed.com> writes:
>>>Again this leads to my question, which comes first the
>>>anatomic variation
>>>or
>>>the ability?
>>
>>ED: Good question. I always keep in mind that the
>>earlier types all
>>died, became extinct, including early cetaceans, early
>>feathered gliding
>>reptiles, as well as primitive apes and our homo
>>cousins. The earliest
>>cetaceans were not suited to spending their entire lives
>>in the ocean.
>>They hadn't fully developed underwater hearing and hadn't
>>even gotten to
>>the stage where their nostrils exited their heads, but
>>their nostrils were
>>merely halfway up their snouts. And it was only after
>>the nostrils
>>reached the head that the echolocation ability arose (in
>>toothed-whale
>>species; since the other whales, the ones that lost their
>>teeth and
>>evolved baleen, never evolved echolocation). Some whales
>>still have
>>paired nostrils coming out of the skulls instead of a
>>singular blowhole.
>>And the Right Whale still has rudimentary hind legs,
>>including pelvis,
>>femur and tibia, connected by ligaments, inside its
>>blubbery body.
>>
>>As for flying reptiles, the earliest had small keel bones
>>to attach their
>>flight muscles to. Modern day species have enormous keel
>>bones the length
>>of their torsos to which to attach far larger and more
>>effective
>>wing-flapping muscles. Early flying reptiles had long
>>BONY tails that
>>created drag, and unfused wrist bones that made any long
>>flights or glides
>>unsteady. Also, as you know feathers evolved before
>>gliding reptiles
>>ever did.
>>
>>The same story for man, we know of over 30 species of
>>extinct primitive
>>apes, all with longer arm to leg ratios than modern apes.
>> So the
>>primitive ape already was nearer to what was to become
>>the genus homo's
>>arm to leg ratio, than it was to modern ape arm to leg
>>ratios. And as you
>>know all the species of primitive ape became extinct, as
>>well as other
>>primates and cousins of the human lineage. A lot of
>>extinct species.
>>
>>I am also reminded of the earliest fish that resembled
>>amphibians, and how
>>their digit numbers varied, some had eight little
>>piggies. But five
>>little piggies won out among evolving species of early
>>amphibians and
>>later, reptiles.
>>
>>There seems to be a lot of whittling down in the genome
>>too, since whole
>>genome duplication appears to have occurred in yeast, as
>>well as in our
>>pufferfish evolutionary cousins, then the wholly
>>duplicated genome later
>>got whittled down. It was in the latest Nature
>>magazine.
>>
>>When I look at our cosmos, and all of the planets that do
>>not contain
>>life, empty real estate, and wasted solar energy beating
>>down on them,
>>makes me wonder if that's not part of a cosmic whittling
>>down process too.
>> Not to mention the fact that on our own planet, seven or
>>more major
>>extinctions of life have taken place, whittling down the
>>dinosaurs,
>>leaving the mammals, that radiated out a lot of weird
>>species, from giant
>>Guinea pigs to Mammoths, that also got whittled down.
>> Is that the
>>Designer's way, is the Designer a whittler or perhaps a
>>Tinkerer?
>>
>>And what about the hypothesis of multiple cosmoses? What
>>if the Designer
>>tinkered around with lots of different original constants
>>before whittling
>>down cosmos after cosmos and arrived at ours?
>> Everything else I have
>>mentioned above would seem to suggest such a thing, at
>>least
>>theoretically. But then, is a Divine Whittler (or Divine
>>Tinkerer),
>>really so far from Darwin's hypothesis of some sort of
>>mutation and
>>selection going on?
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Ed
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
Received on Sat Nov 6 00:24:37 2004