Hi Howard,
It always comes down to definitions doesn't it? I will use the OED's
definition as sufficient for my post.
Miracle - A marvelous event occuring within human experience, which could
not have been brought by
human power or by the operation of any natural agency, and must therefore be
ascribed to the special
intervention of the Deity or of some supernatural being; chiefly, an act
(e.g. healing) exhibiting control
over the laws of nature and serving as evidence that the agent is divine or
is specially favored by God.
Intervene - To come in as something extraneous, in the course of some
action, state of things, etc.
It seems to me that your discussion about Griffin's views does not answer my
simple question about prayer.
Can we sensibly pray to God about intervening in our life or our friends
lives with the expectation that He will hear
and answer our prayer?
Bob Miller
-----
> Robert Miller asks:
>
>
> > If we didn't believe in miracles
> > why would we pray for healing, or a job, or any number of things that
we
> > ask God to intervene on?
>
> The answer to this question hangs on the specific meanings of "miracles"
and
> "intervene" as they are here used. Do these terms entail the idea of what
> Griffin identifies as traditional _supernaturalism_ (God breaks the
> continuity of the creaturely cause/effect chain; God overpowers creaturely
> systems to bring about an outcome that creaturely action could not have
> accomplished)? If so, then Griffin would object and say that that is
> precisely the supernaturalism that must be abandoned is the
science/religion
> warfare is to be resolved.
>
> However, Griffin fully believes that intercessory prayer is wholly
> appropriate and that God does act "variably" in the world to bring about
> outcomes different from what may have otherwise occurred. One of Griffin's
> goals is to articulate a concept of divine action that is both variable
(so
> that, for instance, it can constitute a response to prayer) and
> non-coercive. Traditional supernaturalism includes the option of coercive
> divine action, which process theology finds objectionable.
>
> Bottom line: If I have read Griffin correctly, he believes that you may
> indeed pray for healing, a job, etc., but that in so doing you should not
> expect God to act _coercively_ in response. Rather, you should expect God
to
> act "persuasively" in calling upon the creaturely system to effect one
> possible outcome (the desired one) rather than some other (undesirable)
one.
> Griffin does not believe in miracles in the sense of coercive supernatural
> interventions, but he does believe in the appropriateness and
effectiveness
> of intercessory prayer.
>
> Howard Van Till
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