Glenn wrote
<< We are in the
position of having this revealed to us via Paul. Because of this
epistemological limitation, we must depend upon the eye-witness testimony
for our faith, which is a very good way to do things, but we can't dismiss
the fact that from our perspective, this is a non-verifiable event which
depends upon the veracity of the eye-witnesses. >>
This is true of most of history.
<<The trust of eye-witness testimony is not 100%. How many people each year
are convicted of crimes they didn't do because of faulty eye-witness
testimony? And people can delude themselves. I was deluded by myself as a
YEC to believe the impossible. I went to church for years with a normal guy
with wife and kids, only to learn during the Branch Davidian episode, that
when he was a young-man, he had deluded himself into believing that he was a
new Messiah. And you know what? He had gathered a few followers also who
believed that he was someone special--just like David Koresh did.
Eye-witness testimony isn't all it is cracked up to be.>>
In addition to the testimony of the eye-witnesses we have the testimony of
the Holy Spirit.
Between the two, i.e., objective and subjective, one can find truth as
opposed to delusion if the desire of the heart for truth is really there--at
least for the majors. That is what the NT teaches; and, I think it stands up
to examination.
<<But if as many here want to do, we make the flood nothing but allegory or a
nice theological story, there is precious little I can find that can
actually be verified about the Bible, which then DOES, as you say, mean that
"our faith would have no basis except in >our faith itself."
Just for the record I believe the Flood occurred as a Mesopotamian flood, a
real historical event in real history; but, the Bible writes it up as a
universal event probably because that is the way it was described from as far
back as we have a record, i.e., the Sumerian account. How did the ark go
north? That is just a part of the way flood stories are written: the ark
always lands on a high mountain in the vicinity of the story-teller. Gen 1-11
is not VCR history; but, that does not mean it has no historical value.
<<And that is why I fight the view that you and others promulgate about early
Genesis etc. Early Genesis (the flood in particular) is about the only thing
that even has a prayer of actually being verifiable. If you can lay out a
means of verifying any other event which can be verified from this modern
point of view, then I will gladly listen. But be specific, and don't talk
about the 'great theological Truths' of the Bible--I can't verify great
theological truths.>>
As George mentioned there are a number of archaeological finds which tend to
verify the Bible.
Paul
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