Waco, final comments

From: glenn morton (mortongr@flash.net)
Date: Thu Apr 27 2000 - 17:08:21 EDT

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    First,I would like to say that I thought the conference was great. I would
    congratulate the organizers on a fine conference. However, what they
    presented didn't come across like they thought it would. The Christian
    laity got a chance to see that their arguments are not infallible and that
    some of their heroes can't answer some very tough questions. It is a shame
    that the faculty senate at Baylor is killing the Polanyi center because of
    the above and
    because it will be interpreted as just another example of naturalists and
    materialists who want to stifle discussion rather than engage in it. We
    can't do that if all we do is avoid confronting them in public in front of
    their own supporters. The only way to change Christian perspectives on this
    area is to show that the arguments are weak. This conference with only one
    exception (Paul Nelson's paper) showed the extreme weakness of the
    traditional Christian anti-science position. And maybe the fact that Paul's
    talk was the only really challenging one simply illuminates the emptiness
    and voidness of the other papers presented in defense of the theist
    position. Believe me, the Christians I spoke to were appalled at
    Schaeffer's talk which followed Weinberg. They aren't dummies. They may
    appear to outsiders to be, but they are listening and they do want good
    answers to those atheists. I spoke with several people who were shaken by
    the way the arguments went against their viewpoint. Those I spoke to know
    they didn't get quality when they needed it. That is the first step towards
    realizing that one might need to change ones views.

    As I mentioned in my report, one christian stood by the elevator in order to
    tell my agnostic friend Frank, that Schaeffer was not the best Christian
    apologetics has to offer. Unfortunately, my feeling is that Schaeffer just
    may have been the best and when exposed, it is an embarassment to look in
    the mirror.

    But, the scientific community at large will be glad to see the Polanyi
    Center die.
    They don't understand what a good thing it is for their cause. What a shame.
    No one can prove there is a God or a Designer, but no one can present
    evidence that disproves him either. The truly interesting questions in life
    are those for which we don't have absolute certainty. But we in the
    scientific community will act as if we have absolute certainty and make
    martyrs of the ID group--and this is something that will merely add to their
    appeal--contrary to the their desires.

    My personal objection to the ID movement is what was pointed out over and
    over throughout the conference during question and answer sessions. They
    present no scenario, they don't suggest any new way of doing science, and
    they avoid verification and falsification. They want to wind the scientific
    world without doing the hard and risky work of actually telling us what
    happened. THey are a movement without any cause for which to fight. They
    have no unifying principle. Because of this, they are a broken reed which
    many Christians wish to lean upon. They offer nothing of substance, but like
    the young-earth creationists they just offer wrong reasons to disbelieve
    what modern science is showing. Christian acceptance of this movement will
    be viewed poorly in future years.

     What needs to be done is present carefully crafted arguments in
    forums just like the one that they put on at Baylor. They, unlike the Ken
    Ham and ICR crowd, at least were willing to invite their opponents to the
    table in a non-adversarial/non-spectacle format. Many in science seem to
    want to push
    their opponents away and not beat them at their own game. That looks and is
    tacky.

    John Baumgardner's comment that the naturalists were dominating the
    conference was a telling comment about how the theist position fared during
    this conference. It was sad to see Steve Meyer, a friend with whom I worked
    at ARCO back in the 80s standing there trying to avoid aswering a question
    by saying that his argument was restricted to the origin of life, and saying
    it over and over. It did not show any robustness to this thesis. It was sad
    to see Behe not answer a question seriously when he was asked what he would
    want science to do differently. (He was asked what he would do if he had
    control of all the funding. Ans. keep it himself. And then he did say that
    he wanted someone else to do research in a lab to support his theory. Why
    wouldn't he want to do his own research?) It was sad to see the 'deer in
    headlights' look on Dembski's face as he faced a forest of hands wanting to
    criticize his theory. And the critics were those like Ide Trotter and John
    Baumgardner who should have agreed with him. And I would point you to this,
    from a Christian mother who home schools and with whom I am now having a
    conversation via e-mail. She didn't want her name used because she didn't
    want any crank e-mail. (She is a bit afraid of the mail she might get from
    Christians on this!).

    She said:

    > Even churches that don't support one view over another don't bother to
    > address the faith-shaking issues that college kids will face: I can
    > imagine many of those professors we heard at the conference skinning
    > alive the believers in their classes. Churches do a good job of giving
    > kids the spiritual tools they need for a fulfilling relationship with
    > Jesus, helping them to steer their spiritual boat, so to speak, but they
    > don't give them any intellectual tools. Steering the boat becomes moot if
    > the the believer's boat is on the verge of sinking.
    >
    >I am not sure why youth directors don't perceive this need except that
    >perhaps the kids themselves don't perceive it. In the warm embrace of
    >their youth group, they aren't facing many intellectual challenges and so
    >don't even know about the minefields that await them. Perhaps the
    >majority of youth don't plan to do much thinking at college anyway. I
    >don't know, but from your website and my own anecdotal experience, I
    >think this is an issue that churches need to address.

    The conference was a success as far as educating the Christian community but
    not in the way that the organizers thought it would. This mother, who is a
    home schooler is frustrated and scared by what Christian education is doing
    to her children! And so should we all be scared.

    glenn

    Foundation, Fall and Flood
    Adam, Apes and Anthropology
    http://www.flash.net/~mortongr/dmd.htm

    Lots of information on creation/evolution



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