----- Original Message -----
From: "Jay Willingham" <jaywillingham@cfl.rr.com>
To: "Dick Fischer" <dickfischer@earthlink.net>
Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2002 12:16 PM
Subject: Re: Noahic Covenant
> This begs the question of which account came first and which may therefore
> be derivative or imitative.
>
> Further, we know specifically that false prophets have always abounded.
>
> Jay
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dick Fischer" <dickfischer@earthlink.net>
> To: <asa@calvin.edu>
> Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2002 10:11 AM
> Subject: Re: Noahic Covenant
>
>
> >
> > Vernon wrote:
> >
> > >The true nature and extent of the Flood can hardly be downplayed as a
> > >"non-essential" matter for the Christian because our correct reading of
> > >earth history rests largely upon this one event - as I'm sure you
> > >must agree.
> >
> > We differ actually on what constitutes the essentials of our faith.
> > We also differ on the extent of the flood. For those of us who have
> > spent time studying the flood, myself, Paul Seeley, Davis Young,
> > Robert Best, and others, there is agreement on the time and place and
> > scope. That should tell you something. We use data and evidence in
> > the normal way to reach conclusions based upon them.
> >
> > In his book, "Noah's Ark and the Ziusudra Epic," Robert Best compared
> > the flood texts from Ziusudra, Atrahasis, the eleventh tablet of
> > Gilgamesh (written in four languages), Genesis 6-9, Berossus, and a
> > version from Moses of Khoren.
> >
> > Best concluded, "Distinctive story elements and phrases that are
> > common to two or more of these six stories indicate a common origin.
> > Parallel quotations make it obvious that these six flood stories did
> > not originate independently:"
> >
> > If you know anyone who thinks the flood was global, send them this
> > list. For anyone who thinks the flood occurred somewhere else, send
> > them this list. For anyone who thinks the flood occurred early in
> > the dawn of human history, send them this list.
> >
> > Parallel Quotations
> >
> > "Side-wall ... pay attention" Ziusudra iv, 155
> > "Wall, listen to me." Atrahasis III,i,20
> > "Wall, pay attention" Gilgamesh X1,22
> >
> > "the decision that mankind is to be destroyed" Ziusudra iv,157-158
> > "The gods commanded total destruction" Atrahasis Il,viii,34
> > "The great gods decided to make a flood" Gilgamesh X1,14
> > "God ... decided to make an end of all flesh" Genesis 6:13
> >
> > "Destroy your house, spurn property, save life" Atrahasis III,i,22
> > "Tear down house, abandon property, save life" Gilgamesh
> >
> > "Enki...over the capitals the storm will sweep" Ziusudra iv, 156
> > "He [Enki] told him of the coming of the flood" Atrahasis III,i,37
> > "God said to Noah ...I will bring a flood" Genesis 6:13,17
> > "Kronos...said ...mankind would be destroyed by a flood" Berossus
> >
> > "...the huge boat" Ziusudra v,207
> > "Build a ship" Atrahasis III,i,22
> > "Build a ship" Gilgamesh X1,24
> > "Make yourself an ark" Genesis 6:14
> > "build a boat" Berossus
> >
> > Ïwho protected the seed of mankind" Ziusudra vi,259
> > "Bring into the ship the seed of all life" Gilgamesh X1,27
> > Ïto keep their seed alive" Genesis 7:3 (KJV)
> >
> > "Like the apsu you shall roof it" Atrahasis 111j,29
> > "Like the apsu you shall roof it" Gilgamesh X1,31
> > ÏMake a roof for the arkÓ Genesis 6:16
> >
> > Ïcoming of the flood on the seventh night" Atrahasis,lll,i,37
> > "after seven days the waters of the flood came" Genesis 710
> >
> > "...and addressed the elders" Atrahasis 111,01
> > "I answer the city people and the elders" Gilgamesh X1,35
> >
> > "This is what you shall say to them..." Gilgamesh X1,38
> > "If asked where he was sailing he was to reply..." Berossus
> >
> > ÏI cannot live in (your city)Ó Atrahasis III,I,47
> > ÏI cannot live in (your city)Ó Gilgamesh XI, 44
> >
> > "An abundance of birds, a profusion of fishes" Atrahasis III,i,35
> > "[an abundance of] birds, [a profusion of] fish" Gilgamesh X1,44
> >
> > "pitch I poured into the inside" Gilgamesh X1,66
> > "cover it inside and out with pitch" Genesis 6:14
> > "some people scrape pitch off the boat" Berossus
> >
> > "your family, your relatives" Atrahasis DT,42(w),8
> > "he sent his family on board" Atrahasis III,ii,42
> > "into the ship all my family and relatives" Gilgamesh X1,84
> > "Go into the ark, you and all your household" Genesis 7:1
> > "he sent his wife and children and friends on board" Berossus
> >
> > "animals which emerge from the earth" Ziusudra vi,253
> > "all the wild creatures of the steppe" Atrahasis DT,42(w),9
> > "The cattle of the field, the beast of the plain" Gilgamesh X1,85
> > "clean animals and of animals that are not clean" Genesis 7:8
> > Ïand put both birds and animals on board" Berossus
> >
> > "Enter the boat and close the boat's door" Atrahasis DT,42(w),6
> > "Pitch was brought for him to close his door" Atrahasis III,ii,51
> > "I entered the boat and closed the door' Gilgamesh X1,93
> > "And they that entered ... and the Lord shut him in" Genesis 7:16
> >
> > "Ninurta went forth making the dikes [overflow]" Atrahasis U rev, 14
> > "Ninurta went forth making the dikes overflow" Gilgamesh X1,102
> >
> > "One person could [not] see another" Atrahasis III,iii,13
> > "One person could not see another" Gilgamesh X1,111
> >
> > "to Puzur-Amurri the boatman" Gilgamesh,Xl,94
> > "the boatman shared the same honor" Berossus
> >
> > "the storm had swept ... for seven days and seven nights" Ziusudra
> > "For seven days and seven nights came the storm" Atrahasis III,iv,24
> > "Six days and seven nights the wind and storm" Gilgamesh X1,127
> > "rain fell upon the earth forty days and forty nights" Genesis 7:12
> >
> > "consigned the peoples to destruction" Atrahasis III,iii,54
> > "All mankind was turned to clay" Gilgamesh X1,133
> > "And all flesh died ... and every man" Genesis 7:21
> >
> > "Ziusudra made an opening in the large boat" Ziusudra vi,207
> > "I opened the window" Gilgamesh X1,135
> > "Noah opened the window of the ark" Genesis 8:6
> > "he pried open a portion of the boat" Berossus
> >
> > "On Mount Nisir the boat grounded" Gilgamesh X1,140
> > "the ark came to rest upon the mountains" Genesis 8:4
> > "the boat had grounded upon a mountain" Berossus
> > "After Khsisuthros...landed ...a long mountain" Moses of Khoren
> >
> > "The dove went out and returned" Gilgamesh X1,147
> > "sent forth the dove and the dove came back to him" Genesis 8:10
> > Ïlet out the birds and they again returned to the shipÓ Berossus
> >
> > "The king slaughtered ... bulls and sheep" Ziusudra vi,211
> > "He offered [a sacrifice]" Atrahasis III,v,31
> > "And offered a sacrifice" Gilgamesh X1,155
> > "offered burnt offerings on the altar" Genesis 8:20
> > "built an altar and sacrificed to the gods" Berossus
> >
> > "[The gods smelled] the savor' Atrahasis III,v,34
> > "The gods smelled the sweet savor" Gilgamesh X1,160
> > "And the Lord smelled the sweet savor..." Genesis 8:21
> >
> > "the lapis around my neck" Atrahasis Ill,vi,2
> > "the lapis lazuli on my neck" Gilgamesh X1,164
> >
> > "That I may remember it [every] day" Atrahasis III,vi,4
> > "I shall remember these days and never forget" Gilgamesh X1,165
> > "I shall remember my covenant ...I may remember' Genesis 9:15-16
> >
> > "How did man survive the destruction?" Atrahasis III,vi,10
> > "No man was to survive the destruction" Gilgamesh X1,173
> >
> > "[on the criminal] impose your penalty" Atrahasis III,vi,25
> > "On the criminal impose his crimes" Gilgamesh X1,180
> > "Who sheds the blood of man, by man his blood be shed" Genesis 9:6
> >
> > "he touched our foreheads to bless us" Gilgamesh X1,192
> > "And God blessed Noah" Genesis 9:1
> >
> > "elevated him to eternal life, like a god" Ziusudra vi,257
> > "they shall be like gods to us" Gilgamesh X1,194
> >
> > "I lived in the temple of Ea, my lord" Atrahasis RS 22.421,7
> > "go down to dwell with my lord Ea" Gilgamesh X1,42
> > "he had gone to dwell with the gods" Berossus
> > "Noah walked with God." Genesis 6:9c
> >
> > Dick Fischer - The Origins Solution - www.orislol.com
> > ÏThe Answer we should have known about 150 years agoÓ
> >
> >
>
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