You can also find Max's discussions at:
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/molgen/
Jim Hofmann
Philosophy Department and Liberal Studies Program
California State University Fullerton
http://nsmserver2.fullerton.edu/departments/chemistry/evolution_creation/web
-----Original Message-----
From: Dick Fischer [mailto:dickfischer@earthlink.net]
Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 11:34 AM
To: asa@calvin.edu
Subject: Re: Brachiators On Our Family Tree? (Common ancestry - direct evidence?)
At 05:05 PM 3/25/02 +0100, you wrote:
> Peter Ruest wrote:
>
> > Is there any _direct_ evidence for common ancestry between humans
> > and apes?
Dick Fischer wrote:
> Evidence of genetic linkage between man and other higher primates can
> be derived from an endogenous retroviral sequence imbedded in our DNA
> that is also found at the same point in the DNA of chimpanzees.
> Retroviruses are a particular class of virus, which includes the HIV
> virus that causes AIDS, for example. These viral agents have the
> ability to annex themselves directly into a DNA sequence, and an
> ancient virus apparently did.
>
> The entire genetic code was then passed to future generations,
> including the retroviral sequence. This retroviral sequence has no
> activator mechanism, and thus is harmless, but here is the point. Not
> only do man and chimpanzee have the same number of muscles, bones and
> teeth, our DNA has a correlation of nearly 99%. But in addition, an
> identical alien viral sequence can be found at the same locus point on
> both human and chimp DNA.
>
> A rational explanation is that the viral sequence became attached to
> the DNA of a common ancestor. It has remained in the DNA, and has
> been copied in both man and chimp for millions of years. This
> additional confirming data for relatedness to an animal that already
> looks to be a close relative anyway, makes a strong case for a
> brachiating forbear on our family tree.
Thank you, Dick. This is an example of the type of evidence I was asking
for. Can you give me the reference of the original paper(s) where this
was published?
T. I. Bonner, C. O'Connell and M. Cohen, "Cloned Endogenous Retroviral
Sequences from Human DNA," Proceedings of the National Academy of
Sciences (1982), 79: 4709-4713.
Edward E. Max, "Plagiarized Errors and Molecular Genetics: Another
Argument in the Evolution-Creation Controversy," Creation/Evolution
(XIX, 1986), 34-46.
Is it known whether the two sequences of this retroviral insert have
diverged by the amount expected for neutral evolution for the 6+6 Myr
(or somewhat more)? Have they picked up any stop codons producing
pseudogenes?
I don't know the answer to that.
Do you happen to know of other cases?
I interviewed Edward Max who is (was?) a gene researcher at NIH down
the road a piece from where I live. He discovered a processed pseudogene
in the DNA sequences common to man and gorilla, but missing (or so he
thought) in the chimpanzee.
For those who don't know, "classical pseudogenes" are bits and pieces of
non-functioning DNA scattered along our DNA sequence. A "processed
pseudogene" is where a DNA sequence is processed into RNA, but due to
a fluke gets caught back up in the DNA sequence again.
On the basis of his finding, Max published that it may be that chimps split
off the primate branch before gorilla and man contrary to what was popularly
believed that man and chimp were the last to split.
Well, a Japanese lab did a little investigation, and found that most of the gene
sequence had been purged from chimp DNA, but enough was left to see where
it had been, thus completely demolishing his theory and restoring order in the
phyletic tree of life.
But your questions would be great ones to ask Francis Collins.
Dick Fischer - The Origins Solution - www.orisol.com <http://www.orisol.com/>
"The answer we should have known about 150 years ago"
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