Re: staged developmental creation

From: RDehaan237@aol.com
Date: Sun Nov 18 2001 - 21:20:14 EST

  • Next message: Howard J. Van Till: "Re: staged developmental creation"

    In a message dated 11/16/01 9:56:23 AM, hvantill@novagate.com writes:

    << No, Bob, exactly the opposite. I'm saying that if you wish to posit the

    addition of new formational capabilities, then you have to posit changing

    the character of matter in one or more of the ways I suggested.

    >>

    Howard,

    I fail to see that I must do so. Specifically, in what ways must the
    addition of new formational capabilities that result in the first biological
    cell or protocell change the character of matter?

    <<My hypothesis, on the other hand, is that there is no need for such a

    change; that the character of atoms and molecules includes -- without

    further additions or modifications -- the formational capabilities to

    actualize the system of life.>>

    I_also fail to see why this is true. Perhaps what you wrote below is your
    explanation?

    <<I envision them as resident in the system of the Creation's potentialities,

    a system that is an integral aspect of the Creation's being.

    <<Example: Very early in the formational history of the universe there was a

    brief period of time when free quarks existed, but it was too hot for them

    to form nucleons (protons and neutrons). At that moment nucleons were

    potentialities resident in the character of quarks. As the temperature

    dropped (as a result of the universe's expansion), nucleons formed;

    potential structures became actual structures as the constituent parts

    exercised their formational capabilities.

    <<In a similar manner, there was an extended time period (most of the first

    few hundred thousand years after the beginning) during which the temperature

    of the universe was too high for atoms to form from the plasma of atomic

    nuclei and electrons. During this period atoms were potentialities resident

    in the character of nuclei and electrons. As the temperature dropped (as a

    result of the universe's expansion), atoms formed; potential structures

    became actual structures as the constituent parts exercised their

    formational capabilities.>>

    I agree, in so far as I understand it, with everything you said thus far.
    But are you saying this is the model of how life rose out of resident
    potentialities of atoms and molecules?__Is the next step that molecules are
    formed from potentialities resident in the character of atoms, actualized by
    further drop in temperature? What is the relationship between inherent
    potentialities that you envision and the external environment in which they
    reside?

    Or was some other stimulus needed to actualize biology out of chemistry? I
    have questions both about just what those resident potentialities of
    molecules were and what was it that served as a stimulus to actualize them.

    It requires a leap of faith to use the scenario that you drew of the
    actualization of atoms as a model of how life arose. It's too large a leap
    for me to make, Howard.

    Bob



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