Re: [asa] Ottawa Citizen: The Skeptics Are Vindicated

Dave:

The problem with many of the Bible quotations you've given is twofold: (a)
the reference of the ninth commandment is to legal testimony, not
intellectual matters; (b) even if the quotations you've given (about
uttering falsehoods, etc.), apply to intellectual matters (such as global
warming), they apply equally as well to the people who may have concealed
the truth as to the people who suspect them of doing such. It's as wicked
to tell an intellectual lie as to falsely accuse someone of doing so. Truth
is a two-edged sword.

Dave, without any personal animus against yourself -- you're a personally
modest and solidly constructive poster to this list - I want to amplify the
point I made this morning. I find it really irritating that yesterday
someone here tried to invent a doctrine of "the charitable infraction of
suspicion of wrongdoing" and father it on Christian teaching (or rather, on
the Westminster Confession, which passes for Christian teaching among a
certain set here). If we are going to start yanking verses out of the Bible
that were never intended to have any application to the politics of global
warming, how about all the Biblical verses which talk about God bringing
down the haughty and the proud? No one's been haughtier or prouder --
except possibly Darwinists -- than AGW proponents. Some of them have been
positively arrogant. And now they've been caught in an apparent web of
deceit. Instead of making excuses for apparent unprofessional and unethical
behaviour, and castigating Christians for a legitimate suspicion of
dishonesty in light of very strong circumstantial evidence, we should
perhaps be celebrating that God has once again humiliated the proud by
bringing a very important truth to light. But apparently some on this list
cannot endure the possibility that some of their scientific colleagues and
heroes may have feet of clay. I'm sorry, but I have no pity (if they are
guilty) for the scientists who seem to have their hands caught in the cookie
jar, and I have no sympathy for any soft-hearted pseudo-Christianity that
would forbid us from calling them to account, lest that desire to call them
to account make us guilty of "uncharitable thoughts".

As I say, I'm willing to hold off on final judgment pending a full
investigation of the e-mails. Maybe there's a perfectly innocent
explanation, not just for the one e-mail that Iain has tried to explain, but
for the apparently systemic pattern in all the other guilt-suggestive emails
and the guilt-suggestive programmer's code. We should of course give the
accused the chance to speak at full length. But if the facts turn out to be
what they appear, the appropriate Biblical response -- if a Biblical
response is insisted upon -- is not "gentle Jesus meek and mild", but
full-throttle prophetic rage. Dishonest scientists are a disgrace to
science and a disgrace to humanity. If guilty as charged, they should they
be fired, and never hired by a publically funded institution again. And any
supervisors who gave them marching orders should go down with them. We
would demand the same of any malpracticing doctor or lawyer, or any corrupt
President or Governor. That's not vindictiveness, that's just justice. And
justice (righteousness, same word) is one of the major themes of both
Testaments. A much more major theme than not hurting people's feelings or
not thinking uncharitable thoughts about the motives of others.

Cameron.

---- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Wallace" <wmdavid.wallace@gmail.com>
To: "Cameron Wybrow" <wybrowc@sympatico.ca>
Cc: "asa" <asa@calvin.edu>
Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 6:29 PM
Subject: Re: [asa] Ottawa Citizen: The Skeptics Are Vindicated

> Cameron Wybrow wrote:
>> I'm a lot more interested in what the Bible says than what the
>> Westminster Catechism says. I don't find anything about "misconstructing
>> intentions" in the version of the ninth commandment that's in my Bible.
>> And if there were, Jesus and Paul would both be guilty of violating that
>> commandment, since they often burst out in vituperation against the
>> alleged intentions of the people (Pharisees and so on) that they are
>> addressing or speaking about, with much less empirical evidence for
>> insincerity in most cases than we appear to have at the moment for a
>> degree of coverup in the matter of AGW.
> Cameron:
> I find the Heidelberg Catechism closer to how I read scripture although I
> am not sure if you would find it any better.
>
>> *Question 112.* What is required in the ninth commandment?
>>
>> *Answer:* That I bear false witness against no man, (a) nor falsify any
>> man's words; (b) that I be no backbiter, nor slanderer; (c) that I do not
>> judge, nor join in condemning any man rashly, or unheard; (d) but that I
>> avoid all sorts of lies and deceit, as the proper works of the devil, (e)
>> unless I would bring down upon me the heavy wrath of God; (f) likewise,
>> that in judgment and all other dealings I love the truth, speak it
>> uprightly and confess it; (g) also that I defend and promote, as much as
>> I am able, the honor and good character of my neighbour. (h)
>>
>> (a) Prov.19:5 A false witness shall not be unpunished, and he that
>> speaketh lies shall not escape. Prov.19:9 A false witness shall not be
>> unpunished, and he that speaketh lies shall perish. Prov.21:28 A false
>> witness shall perish: but the man that heareth speaketh constantly. (b)
>> Ps.15:3 He that backbiteth not with his tongue, nor doeth evil to his
>> neighbour, nor taketh up a reproach against his neighbour. Ps.50:19 Thou
>> givest thy mouth to evil, and thy tongue frameth deceit. Ps.50:20 Thou
>> sittest and speakest against thy brother; thou slanderest thine own
>> mother's son. (c) Rom.1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness,
>> fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy,
>> murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Rom.1:30 Backbiters,
>> haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things,
>> disobedient to parents, (d) Matt.7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
>> Matt.7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with
>> what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Luke 6:37 Judge
>> not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be
>> condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: (e) John 8:44 Ye are of
>> your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a
>> murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is
>> no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he
>> is a liar, and the father of it. (f) Prov.12:22 Lying lips are
>> abomination to the LORD: but they that deal truly are his delight.
>> Prov.13:5 A righteous man hateth lying: but a wicked man is loathsome,
>> and cometh to shame. (g) 1 Cor.13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but
>> rejoiceth in the truth; Eph.4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak
>> every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
>> (h) 1 Pet.4:8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves:
>> for charity shall cover the multitude of sins.
> Dave W
>
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Received on Thu Nov 26 23:22:24 2009