Re: [asa] Finding Your Inner Fish

Yes, Bill, the creationists addressed Tiktaalik very quickly. Generally, the
approach has been to simply assert that it is "just another fish" and that
there is no evidence it really walked like a true tetrapod and therefore
wasn't a transition species. The AIG response by David Menton is here:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/aid/v2/n1/tiktaalik-fishy-fish

ICR's Frank Sherwin took the approach that the fossil isn't complete and
claims the dating method was invalid:
http://www.icr.org/index.php?module=news&action=view&ID=63

None of the responses involve any detailed or specific analysis, just vague
generalities that of course it isn't a transitional fossil, it's a species
of its own kind.

Randy

----- Original Message -----
From: "William Hamilton" <willeugenehamilton@gmail.com>
To: "Randy Isaac" <randyisaac@comcast.net>
Cc: <asa@calvin.edu>
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 11:26 AM
Subject: Re: [asa] Finding Your Inner Fish

Thanks for posting this, Randy. It occurred to me that (obviously!)
there is no dialog between creationists and those of us who accept
evolution. It would be interesting to see what might happen if stories
like this were sent to ICR and other creationist organizations. Then
we could maintain a database of stories sent and creationist response.
I suspect we won't get much of a response. But the value of
maintaining the database is that it could be presented to creationists
to establish that we, at least, had tried to establish dialog.

On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 9:21 PM, Randy Isaac <randyisaac@comcast.net> wrote:
> After less than 3 weeks away from this list, it is rather daunting to find
> over 200 unread notes. This is where a peer reviewer is needed--to help
> identify the ones to read!
>
> I just returned from the Harvard Museum of Natural History where Neil
> Shubin
> gave a public lecture tonight to an SRO crowd. His book, "Finding Your
> Inner
> Fish" has been discussed on this list before and was highly recommended. I
> thought he was also an excellent speaker and gave a very good talk. I
> haven't read the book but I presume most of what he said is also in the
> book.
>
> Most of the talk was about the discovery of Tiktaalik Roseae, a fossil of
> the Devonian period. It really is a classic story of scientific discovery.
> Years of intense search for the missing link between fish and tetrapods in
> the wrong place followed by a serendipitous discovery of a promising site
> in
> the arctic. Then many more years of difficult fossil hunting until the
> prize
> was found. More years of arduous work followed until the discovery was
> announced in 2006.
>
> The description of the fossils (about 3 or 4 specimens have been found)
> was
> very interesting. It's not too hard to see the intermediate features
> between
> fish and tetrapods, notably in the neck and the limbs but also in the jaw.
> The most important bone that has not yet been found is a femur and they
> continue to return each year to hunt for one. It seems that the hip socket
> is peculiarly deep and they want to see how the femur connects to it.
>
> The title of his book reflects his perspective that humans contain the
> essence of 3.5 billion years worth of life. Our genetic structure reflects
> elements of all the other organic structures. He noted that in the past
> 15-17 years, many of the Nobel prizes in medicine and related biological
> fields have been for studies on worms and parasites and other small
> species.
> He inferred that many of the critical processes in our own bodies were
> reflected in the "lower" life forms and could be more easily studied
> there.
> He also spoke of the comparison of human and shark embryos and he showed
> the
> early similarities of analogous structures in these embryos. As a fish
> paleontologist, he has been teaching a first-year anatomy course to the U
> of
> Chicago medical school. He tells them that all the major human structures
> were all first seen in fish.
>
> Some of you have read the book and can probably recount this more
> accurately. I thought it was a remarkable story. The evolutionary paradigm
> led to a prediction of the kind of rocks and geologic time frame where
> fossils such as this could be found. The prediction was borne out in a
> most
> dramatic fashion. It really is a storybook case.
>
> Randy

-- 
William E (Bill) Hamilton Jr., Ph.D.
Member American Scientific Affiliation
Austin, TX
248 821 8156
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