RE: [asa] Random Design

True, I guess I'm thinking of fractals as mathematical models for real
things, but I think it also applies as a mathematical or statistical model.

From Wikipedia (Fractal):
"Because they appear similar at all levels of magnification, fractals are
often considered to be infinitely complex (in informal terms). Natural
objects that approximate fractals to a degree include clouds, mountain
ranges, lightning bolts, coastlines, and snow flakes. "

The argument goes (in informal terms), "this thing appears extremely
complex, so therefore it must have been designed". But fractal designs
aren't explicitly designed structures. It is true that there are underlying
rules or techniques by which fractals of various designs are constructed,
but the process of actually creating it is based on random or deterministic
processes that have no further inherent design involved. This might be
analogous to "intelligent design" inherent in nature, which leads to vast
complexity through natural ("random") processes with limited or no further
intervention.

And the real things that fractals are used to model, such as coastlines, are
in many cases formed by a set or series of random processes. Again this
comes back to what is the definition of "complex", which seems to be rather
subjective. I also failed to take into account the ID concept of
"irreducible complexity", which they might hold as not having any
applicability to simply "complex" structures as I've suggested.

Jon Tandy

-----Original Message-----
From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On
Behalf Of Dehler, Bernie
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 3:25 PM
To: _American Sci Affil
Subject: RE: [asa] Random Design

As I understand it, a fractal is not a physical thing but a visual of a
mathematical equation. You could say the same for cones and other things
that can be mathematically-visually graphed...?

...Bernie

-----Original Message-----
From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On
Behalf Of Jon Tandy
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 1:09 PM
To: '_American Sci Affil'
Subject: [asa] Random Design

Would fractals be another, non-biological, example of Random Design? Are
fractals are a good counter-argument to the idea that "random processes
can't produce complex structures with the appearance of design"?

Jon Tandy

-----Original Message-----
From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On
Behalf Of Loren Haarsma
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 2:59 PM
To: _American Sci Affil
Subject: [asa] seminar on God, randomness & evolution: Fri. Feb. 15, 3:30

For the Grand Rapids, MI, area:

The next Christian Perspectives in Science seminar at Calvin College is

        Friday, February 15, 3:30 PM in Science Building room 110.

Speaker: Richard Colling, Professor of Biology, Olivet Nazarene
       University; author of the book "Random Designer"
                    (http://www.randomdesigner.com)

Title: Randomness, Purpose, God, and Evolution: Can they go together?

Abstract:
   The history books of life -- fossils and DNA -- reveal a most remarkable
creation story. Over unfathomable eons of prescribed life and death cycles,

single-celled life has advanced as a divine, majestic, and interconnected
web.
Filling every niche of our dynamic ever-changing planet, evolutionary
creation
has miraculously culminated in sentient beings capable of self and
God-awareness -- us! As Christians desiring to remain faithful and
culturally
credible in our claim that God is the creator and that all truth is God's
truth, we are challenged to work together across faith boundaries seeking
ways
to effectively integrate knowledge from science into a dynamic and coherent
faith. This talk introduces a new creation "logos" -- Random (Equal
Opportunity) Design. Simple, but ultimately profound, random design reflects
a
God-ordained and sustained paradigm of astonishing creative genius that
produces an integrated network of unrivaled biological development. The
talk
includes defining appropriate definitions of randomness, the importance of
adequate information/dot development, examples of randomness generating
remarkable biological order, and a call to expand traditional views of
scripture and science to accommodate a bigger, more profound God.
  ====
http://www.calvin.edu/~lhaarsma/ChrPerspSciSeminarPage.html)

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Received on Fri, 8 Feb 2008 16:16:01 -0600