Re: [asa] Greetings from a new member

On Sun, 8 Apr 2007 08:50:17 -0700 (PDT) Christine Smith
<christine_mb_smith@yahoo.com> writes:
> <snip>
> "ya' know, scientists have such a unique mindset and
> encounter such unique challenges to their faith,
> wouldn't it be great if we had our own special
> ministry/support group that helps to navigate both
> science and religion in a rational, yet faithful
> way?". God was listening to such prayers/needs I
> think, and I not long after that, I found ASA. (Thank
> you for being here!!)
>
> Anyway, what it all boils down to, is that my "crisis
> of faith" essentially stemmed from two primary
> challenges, to which I would be grateful to any
> thoughts/resources you could share with me regarding
> these:
>
> 1. I long ago made peace with the idea that God could
> use evolution to form our physical bodies. What was
> new to me, from the atheists' perspective, was the
> idea that the intangible aspects of us, like feelings,
> emotions, consciousness, etc. (which I had equated
> with the God-given, eternal soul) could also arise
> (ala emergent properties) naturally. Thus, I've
> acquired a new-found interest in the fields of
> pyschology, neurology, and computer science as I try
> to reconceptualize the idea of a "soul".
>
> 2. The historicity of Biblical events also remains a
> challenge. Although I've never taken the Bible
> literally, or have assumed that it was 100% accurate
> in terms of historical events, the atheists raise good
> questions (they claim that temporary burials were
> common back in Jesus's time, and that Jesus could have
> been reburied without his disciples knowledge), and
> even some Christians seem to take the Bible much more
> figuratively than I do (i.e. Jesus was in the desert
> for a long time, not necessarily 40 days, etc.); thus,
> I'm not quite sure through what eyes I should read the
> Bible at this point.
>
> Anyway, I have to get to church, but I look forward to
> joining you all for discussions in the future. Happy
> Easter!
>
> In Christ,
> Christine
>
I trust you had a blessed Easter service, along with lots of people who
have not been to church since Christmas.

I think you're right that scientists have a distinctive mind set, one
that looks to measurable empirical evidence to support a view. However,
there are things that we aren't able to measure at all, some that we can
measure crudely, and some that we can't measure in the immediate
situation. For example, it's been determined that looking at a loved one
results in the production of endorphins, so we feel pleasure in the
situation. But I'm still convinced that the "better felt than tellt" that
I encountered many years ago (and I doubt that it was new then) is still
true. There is additional evidence in the vast gulf between experimental
psychologists and clinical psychologists.

Psychologists and neurologists look for straightforward empirical
evidence. My view is that this does not allow the detection of
nonphysical entities. Randy cited Jeeves' paper. I gave a paper at the
same annual meeting. Jeeves holds that the soul is a function of body. I
argue that there is a connection between soul and body, but that soul has
to be more. Nancey Murphy and her collaborators insist that there is a
God whom they do not detect scientifically. But they do not specify that
there are other spirits, which also should not be amenable to scientific
study.

As for the first chapters of Genesis, I find them evidently intended as
an apology against the pagan myths, especially the Mesopotamian. This
fits the declarations that I note in scripture and theology. II Timothy
3:16f and the Reformation confessions do not speak of science and
history. The latter that note scripture specify either faith and practice
or all that is necessary for salvation. The notion of total inerrancy is
a recent aberration.

As to the argument from an atheistic site that temporary burials were
common, we need to look at what we actually find. Bodies of the well off
were placed on shelves in tombs until the flesh decayed. Then the bones
were placed in ossuaries, normally marked with the name of the deceased.
The implication that bodies were moved from tomb to tomb does not match
what I've found. Grave robbers could remove a body, but not if there was
a Roman guard. Those soldiers knew that failure to protect whatever they
were charged to protect meant death. Additionally, various groups of
disciples claimed to have seen the risen Christ and, when the chips were
down, were willing to die for that claim. The other notion, that Jesus
only swooned and recovered when he was taken down, makes no sense. If one
lost consciousness on a cross, he suffocated. And a spear thrust into the
heart is not conducive to life.

As to faith, my understanding of Ephesians 2:8f has faith the gift of
God. The verse has some exegetical problems, but I think this is the best
interpretation. Otherwise producing faith could be one's own work. So
relax in God's grace and gift.
Dave (one of several on the list)

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Received on Mon Apr 9 00:10:40 2007