Re: [asa] Does ASA believe in Adam and Eve?

*To note just one point, the way in which II Peter 3:5-7 uses the story of
the flood to argue for the possibility of the destruction of "the present
heavens and earth" makes no sense if the writer of II Peter did not think of
the flood as affecting the whole world.*

But Peter uses the destruction of Sodom in the very same context in chapter
2, which obviously is not global. Petelike Jesus, uses Sodom and the flood
as types of the final judgment. As types, neither need be literally as
extensive as the final judgment.

On 3/28/07, George Murphy <gmurphy@raex.com> wrote:
>
> Dick -
>
> Your last comment about me supposedly running back into a burning building
> indicates that you have badly misunderstood me. I have been trying to be
> fairly irenic in exploring your claims but I think that they are wrong. I
> think that the biblical pictures of Adam and Eve make theological statements
> about the first of all human beings, not just the ancestors of a part of the
> present human race. "All" doesn't always have to mean literally "all" but
> it sometimes does, & I think that in context it's highly tendentious to read
> "all" in the relevant places in Genesis as if it means just "aome." I think
> it very unlikely that the present human race descended from a single
> couple. I won't go into detail arguing for those views - you know about my
> recent PSCF article. By discussing your views I have not meant to imply
> that my own have changed and apologize if I have not said "assume for the
> sake of argument" enough.
>
> While there was no global flood historically, what is presented in Gen.6-8is clearly a picture of a catastrophe that wipes out the whole human race
> except for Noah & in fact the whole world. To note just one point, the way
> in which II Peter 3:5-7 uses the story of the flood to argue for the
> possibility of the destruction of "the present heavens and earth" makes no
> sense if the writer of II Peter did not think of the flood as affecting the
> whole world.
>
> Shalom
> George
> http://web.raex.com/~gmurphy/
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Dick Fischer <dickfischer@verizon.net>
> *To:* ASA <asa@calvin.edu>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 28, 2007 11:59 AM
> *Subject:* RE: [asa] Does ASA believe in Adam and Eve?
>
>
>
> Hi George:
>
>
>
> God provided for Adam. In turn, Adam had an obligation. To me that's a
> covenant relationship. Today, we have a gorgeous day here in greater
> Washington. All Washingtonians receive God's blessing equally as did
> Noah's sons. Whether Ham and Japheth enjoyed a covenant relationship as to
> salvation is an open question. I certainly don't pretend to know, though I
> think not. The agreement from God's part was not to bring another
> devastating flood. And that is true to this day in the areas that they
> currently reside. Note the devastating tsunami that struck Asia, for
> example, was not in an area occupied by Noah's kin. Which further
> exemplifies my point.
>
>
>
> When Shem's line (or at least some of it) resided in Babylon along with
> Ham's line including Nimrod, who had a covenant relationship with God? If
> you know I'll abide by your answer because I don't. However, I'll agree
> that at least at the time of Noah, God did establish a covenant with Noah's
> entire family. Salvation history working backward from Christ seems to
> eliminate the branches, though to whom God grants salvation is entirely up
> to him.
>
>
>
> As to this part:
>
>
>
> >>This doesn't invlidate your basic argument about the historicity of Adam
> but it does mean that it's wrong to suggest that the stories about Adam are
> just the family history of Israel. They belong equally to the people of
> Tarshish in Spain, the Ionians, &c - & given what I said earlier, to the
> Aztecs & in fact everyone<<
>
>
>
> I feel like you just ran back into a burning building. The historicity of
> Adam and Noah precludes the Aztecs unless you wish to establish a point in
> time as does Hugh Ross when it would be possible. Do you have such a
> point? C'mon George, climb down out of your ivory tower and take a stand.
> Don't reach for the waffle iron. You want Adam and Noah to be ancestral to
> all mankind, so Adam and Noah, when and where? And don't ask us to go read
> something. Just cough it up.
>
>

To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@calvin.edu with
"unsubscribe asa" (no quotes) as the body of the message.
Received on Thu Mar 29 08:04:11 2007