Re: [asa] An Evolutionary Theory of Right and Wrong

Pim,

In that case I'd probably disagree rather strongly with you. God is
necessary for whatever happens. Reality does not exist apart from his
sustaining role. "Nature" does not exist autonomously of His
governance and concurrence. However, it may be the case that God acts
in such a way via secondary causation that he appears "superfluous".
That is to say that He governs and concurs with secondary causes and
other agents in a such a way that the action can be attributed to the
secondary cause. I'm not 100% that I actually believe this, but, in
fact, much of our understanding of the world (science broadly
construed) seems to be consistent with such a "hidden" role for God.

So, using your words I am saying that God both involved and
necessary. God is only superfluous in the sense that we can explain
at some level phenomena without appealing to Him.

TG

On Oct 31, 2006, at 9:35 PM, Pim van Meurs wrote:

> Each their own beliefs. I have seen examples of the evils of
> religion as well as of the benefits of religion.
> Superfluous merely means that God is not necessary but that does
> not mean that God was not involved. Is that not what causes so much
> concern when people believe that Darwinism has made God irrelevant
> when in fact all that it could possibly do is show that God is
> superfluous. Nothing prevents God from playing a role.
>
> On Oct 31, 2006, at 8:19 PM, Terry M. Gray wrote:
>
>>
>> On Oct 31, 2006, at 3:42 PM, Pim van Meurs wrote:
>>
>>> Note that God being superfluous is not necessarily an argument
>>> against God.
>>
>> This is actually a very interesting sentence. Are you meaning
>> "superfluous with respect to our scientific theorizing?" In other
>> words, this is just a way of talking about methodological naturalism.
>>
>> I'm fairly certain that both Dawkins and Hauser would resist your
>> sympathies with belief in God, even if you distance yourself from
>> including God in your theorizing. This seems to be the gist of the
>> Wired piece--not only do these new atheists not believe in God
>> they think that belief in God is harmful and needs to be resisted.
>>
>> TG
>>
>> ________________
>> Terry M. Gray, Ph.D.
>> Computer Support Scientist
>> Chemistry Department
>> Colorado State University
>> Fort Collins, CO 80523
>> (o) 970-491-7003 (f) 970-491-1801
>>
>>
>>
>> To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@calvin.edu with
>> "unsubscribe asa" (no quotes) as the body of the message.
>

________________
Terry M. Gray, Ph.D.
Computer Support Scientist
Chemistry Department
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
(o) 970-491-7003 (f) 970-491-1801

To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@calvin.edu with
"unsubscribe asa" (no quotes) as the body of the message.
Received on Wed Nov 1 10:53:43 2006