Re: [asa] The Bible does not require a Neolithic Adam!

"Pastoral nomadism is primarily a post–Neolithic phenomenon." -- Steven A. Rosen of the Ben Guerion Institute
http://ioa.ucla.edu/backdirt/Spr00/rosen.html
 
"Pastoral nomadism, an important form of intensive animal husbandry in which farmers constantly move their herds from one poor pasture to another, developed out of sedentary (single-center) pastoral farming, probably in the Sahara where desertification spread after 3000 BC." -- (The _Historical Atlas of the Ancient World_ , ed. John Haywood, vol. 1, p. 1.04).
 
As a cultural phenomenon, the rise of pastoral nomadism is relatively late. Moses' readers would have known about pastoral nomads in north Africa just west of Egypt.
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: dopderbeck@gmail.com
To: glennmorton@entouch.net
Cc: asa@calvin.edu
Sent: Mon, 23 Oct 2006 10:35 AM
Subject: Re: [asa] The Bible does not require a Neolithic Adam!

tents--absolutely proven as long ago as 425,000 years ago, (not a sumerian invention) with claims for tent remains going back 1.6 million years ago.
 
Ok, but Jabal is "the father of those who live in tents and raise livestock" (ASV -- "and have cattle") -- not the father of anyone at all who ever lived in a tent without also raising cattle. Moreover, the Hebrew 'ab translated here "father" can have the meaning "chief," as it does, for example, in Joshua 21:14 ("With him they sent ten of the chief ['ab] men, one for each of the tribes of Israel, each the head of a family division among the Israelite clans.")
 
So we might ask, what would the ancient Hebrew readers of Genesis have thought of when they heard the phrase "the chief of those who live in tents and raise livestock (cattle)?" It seems plausible that they would think of a particular chieftan of a particular tribal group of people -- not of the first paleolithic hunter-gatherers to take shelter in animal skin structures in a cave. (We might also consider the words translated "live" and "tents," which taken together in the ANE context probably denote a more established settlement than a tented hunter-gatherer shelter.)
 
Similarly, Jubal is the "chief" of those who "play stringed instruments and pipes." "Stringed instruments" is the Hebrew "kinnowr," which literally means "harp" and is the term used for a specific type of harp. Again, this requires not just a Neanderthal flute (setting aside the disputes among archeologists and anthropologists about whether the artifacts in question are musical instruments), but also a "harp." So the ANE reader may have thought of the chief of a particular guild of musicians who played in ensembles that included flutes and harps.
 
The text concerning Tubal-Cain is interesting because he is not the "chief" ('ab) but a variant identifies him as one who "instructed" (latash) those who worked in brass and iron.
 
Admitting I'm no OT scholar, it seems to me that a plausible reading is that this passage identifies the development of organized human culture, including these chieftans of agriculture, the arts, and industry, after the fall and before the flood. It's interesting that at the end of this chapter, the text notes that "at that time men began to call upon the name of the LORD."
 
Here we have a pause in the broader narrative before the Adam-to-Noah geneology moves us into the flood story. After the fall, God in His grace allows humanity to realize some of its pre-fall potential, and some fellowship between God and man is restored. It seems to me that the level of organization this suggests is greater than that of a hunter-gatherer culture.
 
I'm not entirely convinced, however, that the level of organization in ch. 4 requires that Adam be neolithic. When we fast-forward to chapter 5 verse 5, we see that man continues to go his own way, inviting another act of judgment. It seems to me that the pre-flood society of verse 4 could have been very small and very local, such that it and its technological knowledge could have been wiped out by the flood, without leaving any archeological traces.
 
But like I said, that's just one thought. Your ideas are interesting too, as are Dick's and as are the less-concordist views that see Jabal, Jubal, and Tubal-Cain more as figures.
 

 
On 10/23/06, Glenn Morton <glennmorton@entouch.net> wrote:
I am going to try to re-focus here. everyone is focusing on childbirth when the big archaeological picture of things is that everything associated with humanity goes back hundreds of thousands to millions of years but Christians don't want to deal with that data.
 
Biological evidence of language--2 million years the 1470 skull has Broca's area impressed on it. Australopiths more than 3 million years ago, may have WErnicke's area impressed upon them. These are brain structures associated with language
 
tents--absolutely proven as long ago as 425,000 years ago, (not a sumerian invention) with claims for tent remains going back 1.6 million years ago.
 
clothing. Humans were living 300 miles south of the arctic circle 300,000 years ago They would have needed clothing.
 
hairlessness and sweating--at least 2 million years ago according to the experts
 
musical instruments in bone form at least 100 kyr ago. But none of the reed musical flutes survive even from the Roman era
 
living off of one species of goat--at least back to the Neanderthals 70-80,000 years.
 
Murder by spear or ax--200 kyr
 
REcognized natural art--Makapansgat pebble 3.2 million years old.
 
Oldest man-made art---400 kyr the Tan tan figurine the second oldest is the 330 kyr Berekhat Ram figurine.
 
pain in childbirth 2.5 million years ago
 
NONE of these things is a Sumerian invention. There is no way any of them can be viewed as such. Thus, if the Bible is to be interpreted as if these things are sumerian inventions, then the Bible is flat out false and there is little sense in claiming that it teaches true theology in the face of such absurd falsity.
 
And if none of the other things which mark humanity out are Sumerian why are we all focused on childbirth alone? It too, like the other things seems to have been around for millions of years.
 
glenn
They're Here: The Pathway Papers
Foundation, Fall, and Flood
Adam, Apes and Anthropology

http://home.entouch.net/dmd/dmd.htm
  
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Received on Mon Oct 23 20:17:25 2006