Re: Reading Genesis literally

You can find "trinities" - i.e., groupings of 3 deities in Hinduism & among the Celts & Babylonians, Plotinus, &c. The Jehovah's witnesses like to make great sport of the Babylonian since it "proves" that trnitarian belief is Babylonian. But in fact none of these have anything to do beyond the number 3 with the Christian understanding of God. Christian belief in God as Trinity is inextricably connected with belief that the historical Jesus of Nazareth is God and that the One he prayed to as Father is God and that their Spirit is God. The doctrine of the Trinity is not about some abstract threeness, groups of three attributes &c.

& no, there is no doctrine of the Trinity in the OT. Abraham, David &c didn't know about it. There are OT passages which connect up to & support that doctrine when read in the light of the NT but that's another matter.

Shalom
George
http://web.raex.com/~gmurphy/
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Dick Fischer
  To: ASA
  Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2006 10:08 AM
  Subject: RE: Reading Genesis literally

  Hi Phil, you wrote:

  I have sometimes wondered if Yah is a variant spelling of Ea.

  When I was reading Mesopotamian literature, I noticed that there was a concept sometimes expressed as the "Enlil power", which the various gods could obtain. When they had it, then it made them supreme. Some stories were concocted to promote a certain city's own god as being the one who had the Enlil power. It has been a long time since I read these stories, so I don't remember the rationale I had at the time, but somehow it led me to wonder if there was a basis of monotheism behind this polytheism, if Ea was Yah and Enlil was also a representation of Yah (we do know that Melchizedek referred to El = Enlil and Abraham was OK with that).

  I have long suspected that the Accadians (Adamites/Semites) had knowledge of the triune god (God) that we know today. How they understood three gods as individuals would probably not be the same as we understand the Trinity today, but I'm not sure we fully understand it either, though we act like we do.

  Remember, the En- prefix denotes "lord" or "king." Adam's grandsons, Enosh and Enoch were likely kings in their respective cities. Accadian ilu becomes El, Hebrew for God. Ea could be an earlier form of Emanuel. Notice that the angel says you will call him Emanuel and they never do!

  Of the three gods in the stories of Atrahasis, Ziusudra and the eleventh tablet of Gilgamesh, who is the one who steps forward to save our hero? Who saves us today? In essence the role each of the three gods played has a ring to it eerily similar to the roles of each one of the Trinity today. And have we overlooked that it says, "Let us make man ('adam) in our image" (Gen. 1:26)?

  I think a case could be made that we rediscovered the Trinity through New Testament teaching. So a possible scenario would be that Adam and his following generations had knowledge of three gods, or a triad of Gods, or (although unlikely), God in three persons. Due to rub off with the Sumerians, they picked up a plethora of gods. Somewhere around the time of Noah, monotheism was established, maybe to keep it less confusing and head off the tendency to expand the hierarchy of gods. Then the concept of Trinity was reintroduced at a time when there was no polytheistic culture in close proximity.

  I know that sounds novel, but there is a smidgen of archaeological evidence to support it, although the archaeologists themselves didn't think of it.

  Dick Fischer

  Dick Fischer, Genesis Proclaimed Association

  Finding Harmony in Bible, Science, and History

  www.genesisproclaimed.org

  -----Original Message-----
  From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On Behalf Of Philtill@aol.com
  Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2006 7:03 PM
  To: asa@calvin.edu
  Subject: Re: Reading Genesis literally

  In a message dated 5/3/2006 11:18:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time, dickfischer@verizon.net writes:

    Ea, second god in importance, has a number also - 40. Can you see any significance in that number?

  Dick,

  I have sometimes wondered if Yah is a variant spelling of Ea.

  When I was reading Mesopotamian literature, I noticed that there was a concept sometimes expressed as the "Enlil power", which the various gods could obtain. When they had it, then it made them supreme. Some stories were concocted to promote a certain city's own god as being the one who had the Enlil power. It has been a long time since I read these stories, so I don't remember the rationale I had at the time, but somehow it led me to wonder if there was a basis of monotheism behind this polytheism, if Ea was Yah and Enlil was also a representation of Yah (we do know that Melchizedek referred to El = Enlil and Abraham was OK with that).

  thanks, Dick.

  Phil

   
Received on Thu May 4 10:30:51 2006