RE: Money is a tool. A Message to Redistributionists

Doesn't this country have a 'Jubilee' mentality in many respects? Every 7th
year, one could declare bankruptcy and have all one's debts forgiven. Didn't
work well, and has been partly repealed - but seems rather Jubileeish to me.

And, are we not 'We the people'? We are the government - at least in theory.
We get a little bit of heavenly blessing, I would hope, for the charity of
this country. Though, that shouldn't complete the picture of our giving.

Debbie Mann
(765) 477-1776

-----Original Message-----
From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu]On
Behalf Of Robert Schneider
Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 9:15 AM
To: Chris Barden; Pim van Meurs
Cc: ASA list
Subject: Re: Money is a tool. A Message to Redistributionists

Chris,

I disagree that Christians have divorced themselves from the old covenant;
if so, it has been a "selective divorce." We are quite willing to overlook
or ignore certain provisions while loudly proclaiming that we must obey
others. Fortunately, the Julilee concept has not been ignored by the vast
marjority of Christians as guided by their leaders. Paul John II proclaimed
the Millenium a Jubilee year and he was joined in this by other Christian
traditions. The Episcopal Church has asked each diocese to meet a millenium
goal of offering a fixed portion of their budgets to helping deal with
world-wide poverty and disease. Other churches are doing the same. Our
giving should be corporate, not only individual. And no one is suggesting
that one should leave charity to the govenment; that kind of either/or
thinking is nonsense.

Bob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Barden" <chris.barden@gmail.com>
To: "Pim van Meurs" <pimvanmeurs@yahoo.com>
Cc: "ASA list" <asa@calvin.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: Re: Money is a tool. A Message to Redistributionists

> Pim,
>
> I suspect Christians do not consider the Jubilee mostly because we
> have divorced ourselves from the old covenant, which is a process Paul
> began and maybe we have taken too far. I will go on record as saying
> the Jubilee is not a command for all the nations, but for the people
> of Israel so that they might be strong through the ages before the
> coming of the Messiah. One can make an excellent case for such a
> system being more effective for sustaining social equality, but that
> does not make it the best economic system for today, especially
> because the world is much more interconnected than in an agrarian
> society like ancient Israel. I read recently that the challenge of
> rich nations today is making sure that social equality remain in the
> face of economic inequality: not impossible, but a challenge.
>
> Jewish people even today make the mistake of believing God's favor
> vicariously extends to them individually because he blessed them
> corporately. A corporate view of charity commits the same error. Are
> we individually storing up treasures in heaven when we leave caring
> for the poor to the government? Caring for the poor is our
> responsibility -- yours and mine and everyone else, and we could all
> do a better job of it. I am not aware of Jesus saying anything else
> on the matter.
>
> Chris
>
> On 3/9/06, Pim van Meurs <pimvanmeurs@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Interesting response, but missing the point again. My comment is one of
>> wonder why Christians seem to be unwilling to implement some biblical
>> teachings while adhering to others. Do we as Christians get to chose what
>> part of the Bible we like or dislike? Is that your attitude towards the
>> Bible or am I missing something?
>>
>> I am not sure where you got your idea about imposing my religious
>> conscience
>> on others, I am merely asking about how others interpret the Jubilee and
>> why
>> it seems to be totally ignored.
>>
>> Perhaps it's time for Janice to read more carefully before responding?
>> But
>> at least we seem to agree that imposing religious belief onto others is
>> the
>> wrong approach.
>> The real question for me however is how Christians deal with the concept
>> of
>> the Jubilee and why it seems to have been mostly ignored? But perhaps my
>> reading of the bible is too literal :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> Janice Matchett <janmatch@earthlink.net> wrote:
>> At 11:58 PM 3/8/2006, Pim van Meurs wrote:
>>
>> How sad. The wealth gap is real and I wonder why Christians seem to be
>> unwilling to apply the concept of Jubilee to rectify these inequities.
>> @ I suggest that you get together with a bunch of other
>> legalistic-minded
>> professing Christians and put that idea into practice among yourselves.
>>
>> But don't think that anyone is going to allow you to obtain enough power
>> and control to impose your religious conscience on the rest of us. --
>> which,
>> like Pat Robertson, et.al., you would do in a heartbeat if you had the
>> chance.
>>
>> ~ Janice
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> So why do you love it Janice since I find few redeeming Christian aspects
>> in
>> the message, other than perhaps 'apologetics'
>>
>> Janice Matchett <janmatch@earthlink.net> wrote:
>> I love it. ~ Janice
>>
>> "Money is a tool. And wealth, accumulation of money, is a bunch of
>> tools.
>> Now when one person, a carpenter for instance, has a bunch of tools, we
>> don't say to him, "You have too many tools. You should give some of your
>> saws and drills and chisels to the guy who is cooking the omelets." We
>> don't
>> try to close the tool gap."
>>
>>
>>
>
Received on Thu Mar 9 09:50:54 2006