Re: Kansas munchkins (as Gould will call them)

On Fri, 20 May 2005 09:09:33 -0400 "Ted Davis" <TDavis@messiah.edu>
writes:
> >>> "D. F. Siemens, Jr." <dfsiemensjr@juno.com> 5/19/2005 11:59:08
> PM
> >>>writes:
>
> Johnson is certain that methodological naturalism
> is atheistic, which is a lie he will not correct for it would
> scuttle his
> political goals. Indeed, one may extend Clemens' characterization:
> lies,
> damned lies, statistics and ID.
>
> Ted replies:
> Now, David, I have publicly accused Phil of a lack of discernment,
> and of
> using unhelpful rhetoric that distorts the issues. Some may equate
> that
> combination with outright lies, but I would not do that myself. I
> have
> known him for about 15 years, and I am convinced that he *believes*
> his
> position is true, including the unhelpful analysis and
> oversimplification
> that comes with it. Phil is convinced that naturalism is
> spiritually,
> morally, and intellectually dangerous, and that those who employ MN
> in
> studying origins are only aiding and abetting the ultimate enemy.
> He
> *believes* those things, I say, therefore I would not put ID
> alongside
> statistics, etc.
>
> Some of the most important things he says are not true--as you and I
> see
> it. But they are true, as he sees it. Incidentally, the person who
> first
> referred to MN as "methodological atheism" was not Phil, it was
> Nancey
> Murphy, and she did so in PSCF. Nancey doesn't see MN as equivalent
> to
> atheism, but her use of that term does suggest that she sees why MN
> *ought
> to* raise theological questions. You and I answer those questions
> differently than Phil does, but he's speaking the truth as he sees
> it.
>
> Ted
>
>
>
Ted,
I recall that Nancey Murphy made a very stupid statement, but it needs to
be read in context, which IDers will not do. You may give Johnson the
benefit of the doubt, but I think the weight of the evidence convicts. He
has been corrected repeatedly. Every legitimate philosophy of science
recognizes the difference between scientism/metaphysical naturalism and
methodological naturalism. He has a political agenda to which the
distinction is devastating. Criminal defense lawyers are trained to use
any means to achieve their goal, normally the acquittal of their client
Dave
Received on Fri May 20 19:59:58 2005