Re: The Impotent God of the Anti-evolutionists 1/2

mortongr@flash.net
Fri, 19 Nov 1999 20:48:34 +0000

At 10:33 PM 11/17/1999 +0800, Stephen E. Jones wrote:
>GM>Obviously you have never played with dice. How did you have such a
>>restrictive childhood? And modern nonlinear dynamics as well as the
>>Heisenberg uncertainty principle shows that even if one tries to have the
>>same initial conditions in any non-linear physical system, you can't.
>
>Since when is a pair of dice, a "non-linear physical system"?

Since the laws of physics which apply to friction are nonlinear. Have you
never heard of friction? Friction depends upon the speed of the object,
the coefficients of friction which vary across any surface thus depending
upon the exact location where the dice land, the friciton of the dice with
the air which is determined by air temperature. Believe me it is nonlinear.
>GM>In that case Stephen, why won't you allow God to rig the chance mutations
>>to produce the evolution from microbe to man?
>
>I do believe that God can supernaturally cause mutations to happen but
>then they are not "chance" mutations.

They are if God makes them so!
>Indeed it is because I believe that God has supernaturally intervened at
>strategic points in the history of life, that I do not believe it *was*
>evolution. The correct term for such a supernatural-natural process is
>*creation*, ie. Mediate Progressive Creation.

So your statement earlier that you thought it was possible for evolution to
occur was wrong?

>GM>You obviously don't know what a random number generator is. It is not
>>uncaused, it is unpredictable as to the output.
>
>Well then there is no problem for theism in such a random number
>generator, since its output is unpredictable to humans but not uncaused.

Can God create a random number generator which is also unpredictable? If he
can't, then he isn't as powerful as us, if he can then he can use one to
drive evolution!
>
>This is not "chance" in Glenn's sense of 2) "the lack of any cause"; or 3)
>"chance as a real cause itself"; but rather chance in Sproul and Geisler's
>sense of 1) "the intersection of two or more lines of causality".

It is unpredictable. If God can create a random number generator then he
can't predict the outcome. If He can't predict the outcome then he can't
predict all things. Yet he could drive evolution based upon that and He
could impose a set of rules on the answers and provide predictability.

>GM>This is more to the point of my post. Nonlinear dynamics has shown us that
>>random chance plus a set of rules equals a certain level of predictability.
>>It doesn't contradict providence.

So You agree that God can manufacture (cause) something whose outcome He
can't predict--is that your position? If so, we aren't so far apart.
glenn

Foundation, Fall and Flood
Adam, Apes and Anthropology
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