Re: Jim's view of Technology

Glenn Morton (grmorton@psyberlink.net)
Tue, 08 Jul 1997 20:59:25 -0500

At 12:40 PM 7/8/97 -0400, Jim Bell wrote:
>JB>Ross mentions a debate going on about "spirit art," art that would
>>indicate "shaman-like" awareness, and thus true humanity. The debate is
>>detailed in Bower, "Visions on the Rocks," Science News, vol. 150 (1996)
>pp.
>>217-217. But note: neither group suggests that spirit art dates back
>earlier
>>than 27,000 years.
>
>GM<<This is your timeframe not mine. Now if you wish to retract this
>27,000
>year limit on spirit art as an indicator of human spirit be my guest.>>
>
>First of all, I reported what is in an article, and the "time frame" wass
>given by the authors. Second, this is about shaman-art. I actually think it
>goes back as far as 35,000 years or so, so I'd expand that number just a
>tad.

So if you believe that spiritual life goes back 35,000 then why did you
object, when I drew the line in the technology chronology at 35,000 and said
that according to you these were animals below that line. Jim, you seem to
have a very short memory. Here is your statement AFTER I said that you
believed in a 35,000 year old origin of spirituality.

>Glenn assigns me an arbitrary starting point. He's wrong about that.

In point of fact I assigned you what you advocate. Why do you get
wishy-washy about this. Stand up and defend your position like a man.

>
>If you think there was shaman-art in all those 4.5 million years, please
>share the evidence with us. To re-cap, here is what modern man's shaman-art
>looks like:
>
The continuous religious tradition of making female fertility idols goes all
the way back to 330,000 years ago. There is a Neanderthal example at about
80,000. In modern times these were worshiped and you have no doubt that
they were worshiped back as far as 35,000 years ago.

>1. The shaman sees two realities--ordinary physical, and extraordinary
>nonmaterial. The latter is the world of the spirit. This is where the human
>soul resides.
>
What about the shaman's cape found on a Neanderthal at Hortus France at
50,000 years?? You know, shamanistic art requires a shaman. A shaman wears
a cape. See my web page for details.

I never cease to be amazed at your selective acceptance of data, Jim.

glenn

Foundation, Fall and Flood
http://www.isource.net/~grmorton/dmd.htm