From: Mccarrick Alan D CRPH (MccarrickAD@nswccd.navy.mil)
Date: Tue Feb 04 2003 - 08:26:50 EST
Don,
Thank you for the more positive aspect of God's continued work in Europe. Of course, you are right, that we can never say that "God is absent" from one place or another. He also does not fail to accomplish His purposes. I only know a small group of individuals that may not be representative. I will continue to follow this thread, and pass on to my friend pertinent information.
I would stand by my observation echoed by missionaries that I have heard of the difficulty of taking the gospel to contemporary Europeans. Compared with the US, religion is indeed greatly reduced in its presence in French society - excluding the growing number of Muslims and occultists. Our notion of freedom OF religion allowing personal expression, the French idea (admittedly, observed within my small group of acquaintances) is freedom FROM religion - you can have any beliefs, but keep them to yourself.
What I want to make contact with "confessing" Christians (to use the older term) in the sciences.
-----Original Message-----
From: Don Winterstein [mailto:dfwinterstein@msn.com]
Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 1:37 AM
To: asa@calvin.edu
Subject: Re: Scientist Christians on the (European) Continent
I don't doubt what Peter Ruest and Alan McCarrick say about the "absence of
God" on continental Europe, but I'm having difficulty squaring those views
with personal observations. Perhaps they can shed some light.
I spent about 2.5 years in Bavaria in the early '60s and two years in
Yorkshire in the early '70s, and I've made assorted other trips to most
countries in western Europe. I often attended Sunday worship services and
presentations of religious music. Catholic services in France and Italy
were often packed. Protestant services elsewhere were less well attended
but still fairly full. I sensed that attendees in northern Germany and
Norway (Trondheim, Oslo) were fairly cold and seemed to go mostly for the
music, but this is just a feeling since I didn't spend much time in those
places. In no place did I have much personal interaction with the people,
but the piety of many of the Catholics seemed obvious.
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Ruest" <pruest@pop.mysunrise.ch>
To: "Mccarrick Alan D CRPH" <MccarrickAD@nswccd.navy.mil>; <asa@calvin.edu>
Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 9:42 AM
Subject: Re: Scientist Christians on the (European) Continent
>
> Alan McCarrick wrote:
> > We had a missionary speak at our church on his work in France and
emphasized the almost complete absence of God from the minds of most of the
French. We spoke briefly afterwards. He was aware of the ASA, but not that
there is a British sister organization.
> >
> > Does anyone know of any similar organization in France or other part of
continental EU ?
>
> In Germany, there is the "Akademiker-SMD", the graduates' and faculty
> branch of the SMD (Studentenmission in Deutschland, corresponding to
> Intervarsity). For March 7-9, 2003, they plan a meeting in Kassel about
> "Materie - der Stoff, aus dem die Welt besteht" ("Matter - the stuff of
> which the world is composed"), with 9 speakers (six physicists - some of
> them also active in philosophy, mathematics, or computer science -, two
> theologians and one historian). The aim of the meeting is to
> "investigate the mystery of the structure of our world from the
> perspectives of the natural sciences, theology, philosophy, and
> history."
>
> But unfortunately, the characterization "almost complete absence of God
> from the minds of most" of the people applies to Germany, Switzerland,
> Italy, Austria, etc., as well. This situation is probably a consequence
> of the state or otherwise publicly privileged big churches having become
> very much secularized, while discriminating or even at times persecuting
> the free churches which base membership on faith. A great majority of
> the populations of these and other European countries are members of
> such big churches, having been baptized as infants. But most of them
> never go to church except for weddings, baptisms, and burials, know
> virtually nothing about the Bible, don't give a d... about anything
> Christian, but would usually be severely offended if it were suggested
> that they were not "Christians". It is not a pure coincidence that the
> theological liberalism destructive of the biblical faith was invented in
> Germany.
>
> Peter
>
> --
> Dr. Peter Ruest, CH-3148 Lanzenhaeusern, Switzerland
> <pruest@dplanet.ch> - Biochemistry - Creation and evolution
> "..the work which God created to evolve it" (Genesis 2:3)
>
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